Full Day Hansard Transcript (Legislative Assembly, 25 October 1995, Corrected Copy)

Mr Speaker (The Hon. John Henry Murray) took the chair at 9.00 a.m.

Mr Speaker offered the Prayer.


Debate resumed from 24 October.

Mr NAGLE (Auburn) [9.00]: I speak on the first Carr Labor budget, which was presented to this House by the Treasurer the Hon. Michael Egan - the first Labor budget since 1987. It will help to keep the debate in perspective if honourable members recall the last four paragraphs of the Treasurer's speech. He stated:

. . . it is a fair budget, and I believe a far-sighted budget.

It delivers our responsible fiscal targets.

And, more importantly, it delivers our core priorities - better hospitals, better schooling, better policing, a cleaner, greener environment, a helping hand to the less fortunate.

It is a budget aimed at setting things right, right from the start.

I submit to the House that that is what it succeeded in doing. There was controversy about a member of the upper House delivering the Budget Speech in the lower House and there was historical dissertation on whether that could be done. But the lower House is always the master of its own destiny. I noted with some disdain that though the Opposition was opposed to the Treasurer delivering the budget in this Chamber it wanted the Treasurer to be available to answer questions on the budget in this Chamber. Not once in the history of this Parliament has a Treasurer answered questions after delivering the budget.

In the seven years in opposition that I listened to coalition budgets being delivered they were mainly heard in silence, with occasionally a "Shame! Shame!". Very rarely the Opposition said "Hear! Hear!". The behaviour of the Opposition during the delivery of this year's budget was disgraceful. Opposition members ought to hang their heads in shame for the way they behaved during this historical event. If they were not so blind and did not have to be dragged into the late twentieth century screaming and kicking they would have realised the significance of what happened. The budget is significant in many respects and I shall cite a few areas mentioned in the Treasurer's speech in regard to savings, jobs and capital expenditure. On page 19 of the Budget Speech he referred to the focal aim of the budget. He said:

In view of the Commonwealth's responsibility for employment programs, the very substantial increase in Commonwealth funding for these programs and continued employment growth, the State Government will redirect expenditure from most State-based employment schemes, to training and education.

In 1995-96 we will be providing 1,000 more training places in technical and further education . . .

It is very important that a large number of people be retrained. My electorate has a very large number of unemployed and they need retraining and re-educating for jobs. The Treasurer went on to deal with where savings would come from. He said:

To pay for Labor's priorities in health, education and other key services and to rein in the deficit . . . Savings of $70 million per annum will be achieved by 1996-97 through a 10 per cent cut in corporate support costs . . . Agency restructuring . . . will save $60 million . . . Major savings amounting to $100 million . . . will also be made by reining in the blowout in the School Student Transport Scheme.

Many Opposition members have complained about the extension of the distance criterion from 1.6 kilometres to 2 kilometres. Recently I travelled from my home in Phillips Avenue Regents Park to Regents Park station, a distance of 1.2 kilometres. I travelled by train to Central and then went to St Benedicts, Marist Brothers, Broadway, a distance of 2.1 kilometres. Every morning I had to travel that distance of 3.3 kilometres to school and the same distance back after attending school. My brothers and sisters had to travel similar distances attending schools around Sydney. We did not receive a bus pass; only a train pass. It is not outrageous that the scheme should be reviewed. When it was introduced in 1971 the cost was only about $4 million but it blew out to $400 million. The aim is to cut back. The Government did not say that all things would be done gently. Some aspects of budgets are good and some are not so good. In regard to jobs the Treasurer said:

We will only have jobs, we will only have wealth, we will only maintain and improve our standard of living if we are competitive.

That is why we have to constrain the level of taxes and charges that impact upon our business costs.

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That has significance for the Olympic Games, which will be sited in my electorate. The showground will be moved to Homebush Bay. Activities in this regard have increased and retraining and re-education of people in my electorate will assist people who have been out of work for a considerable period to avail themselves of future job opportunities. One can assess the budget from media response and there has been little adverse response to the budget in the media. Later when I deal with health I shall also refer to the response of the honourable member for Miranda. On the 7.30 Report on 10 October, referring to the budget, he said:

The best part of the budget is the . . . extra staff in health, extra staff in police, education . . . that is to be commended.

And he is to be commended for recognising that. On the Clive Robertson program on 11 October he said:

The parts I like in the budget . . . [are] . . . the extra police . . . the extra nurses . . . the restructuring of education . . . the building of hospitals . . . in that particular sense I'm pleased with the budget.

We thank that member of the Opposition for his endorsement of those areas of the budget. Bankers Trust spoke in favour of the budget, as did BZW Australia. Ross Gittins said in the Sydney Morning Herald of 11 October:

This budget is all about keeping promises, not breaking them.

Glenda Korporaal said in the Sydney Morning Herald of 11 October:

What Mr Carr is doing is delivering on his election promises - such as slashing hospital waiting lists . . .

In the same newspaper Percy Allan wrote:

. . . an excellent start . . . to get the State back in the black . . . Along with Carr, he [Mike Egan] is establishing himself as the fiscal backbone of the Government.

Terry McCrann, in the Daily Telegraph Mirror of 11 October, wrote:

Bob Carr and Michael Egan have given us a middle-of-the-road budget we can happily live with.

Other people who spoke favourably of the budget included Alan Wood in the Australian and Mike Steketee - of all people - in the Australian. The State Chamber of Commerce stated on 10 October that the budget "is responsible and does not impact adversely on business. Business has room to develop and grow under this budget ". A press release of 10 October from the New South Wales Chamber of Manufactures states:

. . . welcomed the budget saying the decision to cut the State deficit without any new taxes was to be commended.

The Employers Federation also praised the budget. The New South Wales Police Association was happy about the provision of 150 extra police. The President of the New South Wales Farmers Association supported agricultural research being directed to 14 regional centres. Supportive views in articles appearing in country newspapers including the Newcastle Herald, the regional Albury Border Mail, the Lismore Northern Star, the Lithgow Mercury, and in extracts from other newspapers, go to prove that the first Carr Labor budget has been well received.

[Interruption]

When the Opposition starts interjecting you know you are getting to the nub of a matter: the truth always hurts. The Deputy Leader of the Opposition is to be commended for carrying on - when he was Minister for Health - a concept that the Hon. Laurie Brereton initiated when he was Minister for Health, a concept that the Hon. Peter Anderson supported when he was Minister, of putting hospitals into the western part of Sydney. The honourable member for North Shore wants to interject. We hardly ever hear from her. She has not commended herself to this House as a member who cares much about the health needs of the people of western Sydney. She could not even find her way out to Auburn Hospital if she tried.

Mrs Skinner: I have spent more time in Auburn than you have spent on the North Shore.

Mr NAGLE: That is right, because I would not want to go and live on the North Shore. I like living where I live, with the nice people of western Sydney, and that is where I intend to remain. The Deputy Leader of the Opposition, when Minister, instituted a program in the health portfolio to equalise distribution of the budget to western Sydney. That big movement commenced in 1986 and was carried through by him. The honourable member is to be congratulated for introducing equalisation in the health budget for those to the north and west of Sydney; most of the people live in the western part of Sydney. Health budget equalisation is to his credit. On the debit side, the acute care centre at St Josephs Hospital was closed. However, palliative care and rehabilitation centres were created, and the hospital was not completely closed.

Unfortunately, Lidcombe hospital will close in June 1996, one year ahead of schedule. The Health Commission accelerated closure of that hospital prior to Labor coming to power. Be that as it may, some of those beds have gone to Liverpool, to Westmead, and to Bankstown hospitals, the last of which is being rebuilt. That does not create a problem. We are doing our best to change the course of events and improve hospital facilities. A patient receiving chemotherapy would not want to wait out at Westmead for five or six hours, as happened under the previous Government. Under this Labor Government all that will change, or at least waiting time is going to be cut down. No-one would want to sit around in the emergency or casualty sections of Lidcombe Hospital for four to five hours waiting for attention, and that fact should be acknowledged in the budget allocation for
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hospitals. When Bankstown Hospital comes on stream it is to be hoped that new sections of that and other hospitals will be able to cater for the needs of people in the Auburn electorate, as they were told.

At one stage we received in Regents Park, where I live, a pamphlet from the Health Commission saying, "If you have a problem go to Auburn. If you cannot get into Auburn go to Westmead. If you cannot get into Westmead go to Blacktown. If you cannot get into Blacktown go out to Mount Druitt." By the time a person reached Mount Druitt I am sure he would be really sick. I hope that under the new Minister for Health that will not occur, and he will maintain the program commenced by the Hon. Laurie Brereton and continued by the Deputy Leader of the Opposition as Minister for Health in the previous coalition Government. The Labor Government is attempting to slash elective surgery waiting lists, and that should be achieved by March next year. Nurses have commended the budget highly in a press release; we in turn commend the nurses for that commendation.

The education allocation has been increased by 6.9 per cent. Much emphasis has been placed on creating 339 new teacher positions, expenditure of $86 million on computers and technology, new community language teachers, and higher school certificate coaching. Great efforts have been made in technical and further education. In the Auburn electorate, Lidcombe TAFE, an excellent facility, offers industry-based education. In the north of the electorate is Bankstown TAFE and to the west is Granville TAFE. Those three colleges cater for our education needs. I would say, given the extra money allocated to education and especially to technical and further education, that many of the 5,000 new places will end up at those three TAFE colleges. People in the Auburn electorate, which suffers a high rate of unemployment, will have a chance of gaining employment.

A project commenced by the previous Government and continued by this Government is the rebuilding of Auburn North primary school. At that school about 97 per cent of students have an ethnic background, as does West Auburn with about 90 per cent. We need teachers who can teach these children English so that they can understand the studies they have to undertake to help them gain jobs in industry, for instance as carpenters or electricians, or to help them acquire the higher school certificate to assist entry to university. Remarkable people have passed through these schools and have gone on to study medicine, law and engineering, or have entered TAFE courses such as panel beating, carpentry, electrical work, and in other disciplines.

In the Auburn community there are 31 major and 31 minor ethnic groups. High schools in the electorate, such as at Auburn, Granville and Sefton, and Birrong Boys' High School and Birrong Girls' High School, as well as primary schools, are receiving better funding. I will be approaching the Minister for Education to ensure that air conditioning is provided for the demountables at West Auburn. On hot days in February or December when school is in session it is hard for students and teachers to use the schoolrooms and library because of the heat. I will be pressuring the Minister for Education to get a few air conditioners for the kids out there. Education is a high priority in the Auburn electorate because it gives the kick-off in life everyone needs to give them a fighting chance. I have always had the view that if children are educated and given a chance to acquire self-respect and develop initiative, they will keep out of the drug and crime scenes.

I turn to the provision in the budget for crime prevention. The previous Government did a fair bit in the Auburn electorate from its early days in 1988, and I commend its work in appointing more police to the Auburn area. The electorate did not receive as many police as did patrols in other, non-Labor electorates, but Auburn had and still has dedicated police who have provided excellent street policing and have cut back delays in the provision of service. They have done a great job in moving out some of the heroin traffickers so visible on the streets in 1988 and 1989. People tell me that they can walk along the streets now without seeing a drug sale occurring; that may be happening privately, but not on the main street. However, we could do with more police.

The Lidcombe Police Station was closed down by the previous Government, but after pressure from myself and discussions with the then Minister for Police, Ted Pickering, and later with his successor as Minister for Police, Terry Griffiths, we were able to reopen that station for about nine hours a day. Thus a policing outlet has been retained in the area, with the hope that the situation could be improved. In due course a new police station is to be built at Auburn. The budget allocation for the crime prevention policy of this Labor Government shows a 5.3 per cent increase, with emphasis on neighbourhood watch. That program was very successful when it was in operation, and it should be resurrected with the assistance of insurance companies encouraging people to support it. Night courts, another excellent idea, have been tried previously, and if well organised they can succeed. Alternative dispute resolution and emphasis on arbitration and mediation will reduce court backlogs by mediating disputes between people. [Extension of time agreed to.]

The Bankstown Community Justice Centre does a great job in the area. Hopefully we might be able to get another centre elsewhere in the electorate in the future. Our sentencing programs are well defined, and the Government is doing whatever it can to reduce the waiting lists for victim compensation and counselling. Many of those programs will be carried on by the present Government. I refer to the environment in the
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Auburn electorate. There is a large industrial site to the north of Auburn, and occasionally there are pollution problems. Extensive efforts are being made to protect the environment. Wilson Park was a great idea in 1973. It was created on the old Hackle site. When the Hackle site closed down the company took over part of a soccer field and the council took over the Hackle site. We were not told about the nasties they had buried.

The Federal Government and the State Government - both Labor and Liberal governments - contributed funds to build a sporting ground, barbecue area and a walking track on the site. Within five years poisons oozed up through the ground and into the Parramatta River. A lot of money will be required to resurrect that area. A project is currently under way and in due course Wilson Park will be remediated. If the plans for the Olympics go ahead people will be able to go on a nice walk from Silverwater Bridge to the Homebush woodlands, known as Newington bush. The walking track will bypass the Olympic village. I hope that project is on track as part of the Olympics program. A total of 24 new national parks have been created in the area. Those areas will be preserved for all time - for the people and children of the future to enjoy.

Public transport is playing a significant role in the electorate. I refer to the funding from the budget for the State Rail Authority's capital and major periodic maintenance works. In 1994-95, $506 million was allocated but for this year $595 million has been allocated. Some of that money will be allocated to the Homebush Bay rail link. Work is being carried out on the East Hills line. Security at railway stations will also be upgraded. In addition, many pensioners in my electorate would like the toilets at the railway stations opened. I hope some of the money will go towards that. The Auburn electorate has done very well in this budget with regard to funding for roadworks. During the seven years of the previous Government I fought for the widening of St Hilliers Road. That widening has just been completed, except for $400,000 worth of work which needs to be done on a major intersection.

I have approached the Minister for Roads and there will be a three-lane extension from Boorea Street, Lidcombe, through to the overhead railway line. There will be a widening of Olympic Drive to six lanes from Boorea Street to Church Street and all the way through to Kissing Point Road at Ermington. The cost of that work is $2 million for the six lanes of work. We were hoping that we would have all the work done on the Hume Highway at Chullora. I had information that the money was to be allocated to another electorate. I heard the honourable member for that electorate complaining that his electorate was not going to get money for roadworks. But over the last two years that electorate got a fantastic amount of money for roadworks. Now the roadworks will be done where they should have been done in the first place.

Money is being allocated for the overpass which has been in the planning stage for the last seven years. The previous Government allocated $2 million to commence the work. This Government is now providing the money. There will be an extensive flyover and road construction on the corner of the Hume Highway and Roberts Road, which will do away with the blockage of traffic in the morning and afternoon at Chullora. People in that area are thankful for the work being done. I refer to the Stacey Street bypass across the Hume Highway. The previous Government looked into that. This Government will allocate money for that project. The Stacey Street extension will commence from Wattle Street to Rookwood Road. It will go via the water tank on the Hume Highway to Stacey Street with a flyover. Residents at North Auburn are suffering. People are avoiding the M4. The difficulty is caused by people going down Parramatta Road to bypass the M4. This has created a problem. The Government has allocated money for a traffic study into that difficulty in the North Auburn and Silverwater areas. It wants to find out what programs can be put in place to alleviate the burden on local residents.

I refer to the money that has been set aside for the Olympics. The previous Government put a lot of effort into obtaining the Olympics for Sydney. The works will cost a lot of money. Many millions of people will use the site in the future. At the turn of the century, in the year 2000, the Olympics will bring Australia generally and New South Wales in particular a great deal of kudos. I hope that people will see the worth of the Olympic Games for Sydney. The facilities at Homebush will be used during the two weeks that the Olympics are held, but they will also be used by many other people in the future. On the downside, Auburn Council used to receive approximately $850,000 in rates from the old abattoir site at Homebush. When the abattoirs closed down to provide the venue for the Olympic Games Auburn Council lost that revenue. It also lost revenue from other sites in the Homebush area. I have brought this sorrowful tale to the attention of the Minister for Local Government, who is in the House, on a number of occasions. Be that as it may, Auburn has suffered because it has lost $850,000 in rates.

I hope that revenue loss will be offset by the Olympic Games and the site providing jobs for people in the Auburn area. The Auburn electorate has done well in this budget with respect to education, roads, transport and health. I hope that in the next Egan budget the electorate does even better as the economy improves. I refer to housing. There are a large number of projects for low-cost housing commission accommodation which is greatly needed. An amount of $8.2 million is being spent in the next financial year to build accommodation for these people. Rates are to be given to the council from the water authority. Auburn will get $280,000 and Bankstown will get $3,350,000. I commend the Treasurer and the
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Premier on an excellent budget. It will work. The people of New South Wales will be better off under this Government than they were under the previous Government. This budget aims to set these things right right from the start.

Mrs SKINNER (North Shore) [9.28]: When the Carr Government came to office six months ago it inherited a health system described in September last year by none other than the current Minister for Health as "the best in the world, certainly the envy of most of the world." Let us look at what he inherited and why our health system earned his praise. The coalition, during its seven years of Government, undertook a major upgrade of the New South Wales public hospital system. It ensured that whilst people had access to latest treatment techniques using state-of-the-art equipment, the provision of highest-quality care for the individual patient was paramount. In seven successive annual increases the coalition took the New South Wales health budget to a record $5.75 billion in 1994-95. The average waiting time for elective treatment in New South Wales hospitals stood at 25.5 days, the lowest of any State. In March of this year the Federal health Minister, Carmen Lawrence, wrote to the former New South Wales health Minister, Ron Phillips. She stated:

I commend you on the results . . . (in reducing waiting times) . . . achieved in NSW and appreciate your commitment to even greater improvements in public access to health services.

In seven years the coalition had built or redeveloped 33 hospitals. In its last year of government new hospitals valued at $1.1 billion were under construction, and another $835 million had been budgeted to construct 52 hospitals over the next term. A total of 75 per cent of hospital capital works funding was spent in Labor electorates. Those works included the massive new children's hospital, which opened in Westmead earlier this week. That hospital was built entirely with coalition funding following a decision the Leader of the Opposition made in 1989 as Minister for Health to reverse a Labor decision to keep the children's hospital at the old, cramped Camperdown site. In April this year the new Labor health Minister said he thought the New South Wales health system was "still the best of any of the States". His comment is worth thinking about. His use of the word "still" indicates that he knew he was creating havoc with the health system and that it was only a matter of time before the deterioration became blatantly obvious.

The Minister for Health has already admitted to health managers that he was not a party to the reckless promise made by his leader, Premier Bob Carr, to cut 25,000 patients off elective hospital waiting lists within 12 months or both of them would resign. He has not publicly walked away from that promise, but it is little wonder that he has refused to repeat it. The Minister for Health knows the target is impossible to achieve without administrative manipulation and fudging the figures. Worse, he knows that the pressure being applied to hospitals to meet impossible waiting list targets that he and his Premier have imposed has led to a steady deterioration of quality health care. One of the regional managers told me:

We've been dudded. There is a shift of resources away from good programs to a program that is politically driven. The Waiting List Program is like a sponge soaking up much needed resources.

Mr E. T. Page: Name your source. Anonymous balderdash!

Mrs SKINNER: If the Minister for Local Government waits, I will name them. The manager continued:

. . . there is a 50% shortfall in funding for the Waiting List Reduction Program and we're having to bleed hospitals and other community health services to prop it up.

My health informant prefers not to be named, just as the many others who are making contact ask for anonymity. Small wonder! They have received memoranda stating that they will be sacked if they talk. That is a scandalous state of affairs. They have been instructed to inform Opposition members that all questions must go through the Minister. So much for democracy and the rights of local members to represent their constituents.

Mr Schultz: Hear! Hear!

Mrs SKINNER: My colleague can speak about that. The Opposition will produce some of those memoranda. I can assure the Government that the media will take a great deal of interest in them. This Government and the Minister are about secrecy and control. They are about saving their political skins at the expense of New South Wales patients. This winter there have been numerous stories of sick children being turned away from hospitals and of ambulances being instructed not to stop at hospitals because of lack of beds. Documents received under freedom of information provisions show that hospitals all over the State are being forced to reserve beds for waiting list patients. A memorandum leaked from the Southern Sydney Area Health Service instructed Sutherland Hospital that a 20-bed ward was to be established at the hospital and that "all surgical beds are to be quarantined (for waiting list patients)". The memorandum continued:

Under no circumstances are medical or surgical patients to be admitted to this ward from the Emergency Department.

On 2 March 1994 the honourable member for Marrickville as the shadow minister for health said in this House:

Are the Government's policies really working when it is closing beds and making it more difficult to get patients out of accident and emergency centres?

That is worth thinking about. Health managers and clinicians clearly do not believe that this Government's health policies are working. They are concerned about the obvious lack of support for
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programs such as the emergency department incentive scheme, which has suffered a budget cut from $8.5 million to $6 million this financial year. How do we know what the Government has allocated to health regions so they can operate hospitals, community health centres and other essential health services? Unlike the previous Coalition Government, the Labor Government has provided no detail in the budget. According to health administrators, who have only just received a copy of a list leaked last week to the coalition, the money they are to receive is insufficient to cover operating costs. Representatives from even more hospitals in country New South Wales will come to town to beg for supplementary funds to pay bills owed to local small businesses and to enable them to keep their doors open.

The Government will not have long to wait until hospital administrators approach it with these pleas, if they have not done so already. A glaring example has come to light already. Last weekend a surgeon complained of a cutback in operating theatre time he had been advised he would have at the new children's hospital when it moved to Westmead. The hospital has confirmed that 44 planned operating sessions will be cut each month because of budgetary problems and a shortage of skilled nurses. I quote none other than the chief executive, Dr John Yeo. The hospital was allocated $97.9 million in recurrent funds by the coalition in last year's budget. I am advised that actual expenditure amounted to $94.4 million, which raises questions about unspent budget allocations, but that an extra $10 million has been made available as special purpose funds.

This money is obviously designed to cover the cost of the move of the hospital rather than to provide the additional funds needed to operate an expanded facility. If that were not the case, one would have to ask why two of its eight new operating theatres were not opening when there was all this extra money. Why is the hospital saying it cannot afford to pay more theatre staff than it had at the old Camperdown Hospital, which has only six operating theatres? The figures simply do not add up. If the operating theatres are closed because there is no current demand for them, why is the Minister providing extra money to enable more waiting list patients to be treated? And why were the 44 sessions, which amount to at least 176 operations a month and 2,000 operations a year, scheduled in the first place? The truth is that the Minister for Health is playing definitional games with the health of the young patients of the new children's hospital, just as he has done with the 5,500 patients he has excluded from hospital waiting lists by changing the formula.

Mr Gibson: Name them.

Mrs SKINNER: I will find them, and I will name them on the day that the Premier and the health Minister have to resign. The Minister will be only too pleased to claim credit for the opening of the showcase new hospital built entirely by the coalition government, but he is forcing that hospital to function at only three-quarter capacity. That is on top of the harsh treatment of the Western Sydney health region, which received only 0.7 per cent more recurrent funding than last year at a time when the growing population and the high cost of replacing and upgrading expensive medical equipment demand more. I was interested to note in the budget papers that few extra staff are to be employed during the year, given the large increase in demand. For example, only 31 more full-time staff will be employed in outpatient services throughout the entire health system.

Other big losers in the share of funds are the people of Murrumbidgee, which suffers a decrease in real terms of 0.71 per cent, the north-west, with an increase of only 0.18 per cent, central Sydney 0.32 per cent and Murray 0.83 per cent. That reduction precedes a review of country health services and it may foreshadow the abolition of some services by the Government, taking control of health services away from local people, particularly country people, and putting it in the hands of the central bureaucrats. The Government has been obliged to report on its commitment to capital works. There is a record of broken promises and total disregard again for country New South Wales and for western Sydney. The Leader of the Opposition in his reply to the Budget Speech spoke about the Government's willingness to rebadge coalition projects. He cited Blacktown, Lithgow, West Wyalong, St Vincent's and Dubbo hospitals as examples of coalition projects reannounced by the Labor Government.

The Government has broken promises made during the March election campaign to fund works at the new Coffs Harbour Base Hospital, at an estimated total cost of $48 million, and upgrades of the Manning Base Hospital, at a total cost of $15 million, and Armidale Hospital, estimated to cost $11 million. This gives honourable members an interesting insight into the hypocrisy and deceit of the Carr Government and the Minister for Health. Their motto is obviously, "Say whatever you like so long as it gets you elected. People will forget your promise by the time the next election comes around." I notice an honourable member opposite nodding. What did Labor promise the people of Armidale? The current Minister for Health said in a press release dated 8 December 1994:

The Government must recognise that Armidale is the second most badly resourced hospital in the State and fix the problems as a matter of urgency . . . the people of Armidale need and deserve a better deal in health.

Obviously, the Minister believes that the people of Armidale do not count as he has not provided 1¢ towards improving what he described only 10 months ago as the second most needy hospital in the State. Last week the Leader of the National Party asked the Minister for Health whether he had broken a promise by dropping Armidale, Coffs
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Harbour and Manning Base hospitals from the capital works program. The Minister's answer was no. That answer was of much interest to district health services and local members, who have provided me with details from the 1995-96 capital projects report for their electorates provided by the New South Wales Treasury. How much money has the Minister provided for Armidale Hospital in the electorate of Northern Tablelands? Zilch. No money is allocated for the promised $11 million upgrade. The same situation applies with the two other hospitals about which the Minister misled the House last week.

I am sure that doctors, nurses, hospitals, health region administrators and the people of those country areas will be interested in the Minister's dishonest statement to Parliament and in his obvious disregard for their health needs. The Minister does not care for other communities either. He has failed to provide promised funds to refurbish or develop Camden, Cowra, Bellingen and Tumut hospitals. The Treasury report list also shows the projects that have been sold short by the Labor Government. Work was to start on the second stage of the Nepean Hospital redevelopment, but the $70 million required, which was committed by the former Government, is nowhere to be found in the Carr budget papers. It is not found because it is not to be provided.

The former coalition Government spent $88 million on the first stage of the Nepean Hospital project bringing the facility up to teaching status. The second stage was to include a new maternity wing to give mothers and babies in Sydney's fastest growing area access to their own modern local facility. It is the people of western Sydney who have been the big losers under Labor. The Nepean Hospital has been delayed by at least three years, and work on Liverpool Hospital, which Labor promised to fast track, has also been delayed by two years. It is interesting that Labor members from that part of the world have not spoken up and screamed about the lack of funding for hospitals like west Nepean and recurrent funding to western Sydney. Stage five of the St George Hospital development has been delayed by two years, as has the building of the new Innerwest Hospital at Canterbury. The political decision to stop work on the Innerwest Hospital at Croydon and to move the facility to Canterbury cost not only two years of service provision but also led to more than $5.6 million of the funds allocated to construct the new hospital being spent without any gain. As the Leader of the Opposition said in his reply to the Budget Speech, it is the left factional bloody mindedness of the present Minister for Health that has cost the people of this State these much needed facilities.

By refusing private sector involvement in construction of the ambulatory clinic for the Prince of Wales Hospital, the Minister not only delayed that project but he also had to find the $89 million required for the project from the public purse at the expense of other projects. A close examination of the health capital works budget shows that almost $41 million of the 1994-95 capital works funding allocated by the coalition Government has not been spent. On the assumption that this allocation has been carried forward, simple arithmetic shows that Labor has cut health capital works spending by $18 million. Numerous big ticket underspending items are listed, and I will mention a couple of these. The allocation for the Ballina Hospital redevelopment was underspent by more than $500,000; that for the Albury Hospital redevelopment was underspent by more than $1 million; and only $50,000 was spent of the $3 million allocated for the relocation of the eastern Sydney HIV-AIDS unit. That is shameful.

The other portfolio that I shadow for the Opposition is youth affairs. Young people have fared poorly under the Carr Labor Government. They rate 1½ pages in the very flimsy social justice budget statement. What does the Government claim as its most important youth initiative? It states in bold type in the document that "young people will now have a direct voice to the Premier as the Youth Advisory Council now reports directly to him". The Youth Advisory Council was established by the former coalition, and since its inception in 1989 it has met with the Premier, along with many other Ministers, on a regular basis. Of course the council must report to the Premier now as he has not considered young people of sufficient importance to warrant the appointment of a youth Minister. But wait. The next line in the budget outlines another key initiative of the Government - the appointment of a Minister Assisting the Premier on Youth Affairs. The Premier needs as much assistance as he can get as his credentials in the youth sector amount to zero.

In the 80-page youth budget produced by the coalition Government last year, information was provided about 360 programs with a total allocation of more than $2.5 billion. The handful of programs identified in this year's sick little budget paper are all initiatives of the former coalition Government. The programs, located in areas where disadvantaged young people are found - mostly Labor electorates - include the helping early school leavers program, time out, circuit breaker and the Koori youth program, which I had the privilege of helping to design and implement during my five years as leader of the Office of Youth Affairs. I particularly inform the honourable member for Auburn of that fact, as he continually slings off. The Government's total disinterest in young people, particularly the young unemployed, who are most in need, is demonstrated by the abolition of all State youth employment programs in this year's budget. [Extension of time agreed to.]

A press release from the youth peak organisation, the Youth Action and Policy Association, stated:

The State budget handed down by the NSW Labor Government fails young people most in need. With youth unemployment in NSW around 30%, 82,000 young people in NSW have little or nothing to thank the Premier for.

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The slashing of youth employment programs sends a powerful message that the Carr government does not care about young people, particularly those most in need of support.

The Premier has fobbed off unemployed young people by saying that his Labor cronies in Canberra will provide for them. That is not so. As YAPA pointed out, Federal Labor has failed to pick up youth employment programs; instead, it is cutting programs that assist young people to find work. I am familiar with the youth employment programs slashed by the Labor Government because I have visited many of them in different suburbs of Sydney and in rural townships. The programs axed include get started, work experience, work place and youth business initiative. Earlier this week the operators of some of those programs rallied outside Parliament House pleading for assistance on behalf of their young clientele. The abolition of the programs represents a loss of more than $10 million that had been used to help young unemployed people in this State. The Labor Government stands condemned not only by every young person it supposedly represents, but also by their parents, extended families and friends.

The Government also stands condemned by the people of the electorate of North Shore, who will remember the infamous remark of the Minister for Roads that the rich of North Shore could pay for the roads of western Sydney. His arrogant condemnation of my constituents shows his total ignorance and the Government's total disregard for the people north of the harbour. Capital works funds were provided last year under a coalition Government for health projects at Royal North Shore Hospital, including works involved with upgrading the emergency department and the provision of an angiography suite. This year, health funding for that hospital is nil. Last year the coalition Government provided $8.7 million towards housing people the Minister described as the "rich of North Shore". This year the housing allocation is nil. Last year coalition education projects received $1.75 million, and this year the allocation is nil. Last year the coalition provided project funding of $3.7 million to State Rail for works totalling $20 million. This year, $785,000 is provided, including funds to provide a lift at Milsons Point station. I sincerely thank the Minister for Transport for reversing his initial decision to cancel the project following a submission I made to him on behalf of my constituents, who joined me in hard lobbying for the much-needed work.

Last year the Water Board allocated $700,000 for work on the run-down sewerage system. This year the allocation is nil. That is an ongoing major problem for the area. Taronga Park zoo, the only winner, received $4.7 million last year; this year it will get $8 million. Last year road funding totalled $11.4 million; this year's allocation is $8.6 million to cover routine maintenance, road upgrading and the harbour bridge. The Government has failed to make any financial commitment to solving the ever-increasing problem of overcrowded roads. It is expected that North Shore constituents will pay the price demanded by the Minister for Roads because the Government broke its promise on tolls. Funds allocated last year by the coalition Government followed substantial funding for projects that had been sadly neglected by the previous Labor Government. This year's neglect is a sorry projection of things to come, but I pledge to my electorate my continued strong representations on their behalf.

Mr SULLIVAN (Wollongong) [9.50]: It gives me great pleasure to speak to the budget. This is a good budget for the Illawarra, which was so poorly treated by the former Government over the period 1988 to 1995. The jewel in the crown of this year's budget is the provision by the Carr Labor Government of $125 million worth of work and $125 million worth of jobs in the Illawarra. The Government has been in office for only a few months but it has already turned around all the dead wood and the dry rational nonsense of the former Government. At last New South Wales has a caring and concerned Government that will deliver.

The budget allocates $11.475 million this financial year to the clinical services building at Wollongong Hospital, which will cost a total of $46.2 million. As I said yesterday, work on the building has begun. The streets behind the hospital, including a section of Loftus Street, have been rezoned for construction vehicles only. Builders offices and huts are appearing on site, including on the front lawn of the hospital, but Wollongong is prepared to wear that. The first floor of the clinical services building on the new Dapto Road-Loftus Road level, level 0, will have a loading dock, service entry and delivery and associated storage. The second floor, or level one, will contain the main entrance, records, admission, security, emergency and radiology, I understand, centred around a major atrium.

For many years Wollongong Hospital has not had a front door. Entry could be gained from Crown Street, at the eastern end near casualty, from the old main entrance through Hickman House, off the car park, or from the western end, which many medical practitioners used as their favourite exit and entry point. But the hospital never had a front door. The three-storey Marshall Andrew building built in the late 1950s as part of the important antituberculosis program conducted by the State, the nearby mortuary and the single-storey building often referred to as the sewing building - where sheets, blankets, towels, pillow cases and so on are stored and repaired and the interpreters are housed - will be demolished.

The third floor, or level two, of the new building will house the theatre complex, which will include eight new operating theatres, as well as a recovery ward, intensive care unit, a high dependency unit, a new mortuary and a refurbished
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birthing unit. It is important for honourable members to appreciate that Wollongong Hospital has effectively had only six operating theatres, three in what is called the services building, which was constructed in 1968, and three in Hickman House, which was constructed in 1948. I have been told that Hickman House was designed in the 1930s but construction did not proceed because of World War II. It was one of the first major hospital buildings commenced in this State after World War II. That facility has largely remained unaltered since 1948.

The location of eight modern, state-of-the-art operating theatres near the recovery ward, the intensive care unit, the high dependency unit and the birthing unit on one level will be of major benefit. No longer will people have to go from one floor to another within the services building and Hickman House. The fourth floor, or level three, will have two 25-bed general wards plus a biomedical engineering centre, the central sterilising department and a refurbished endoscopy unit. On the fifth floor, or level four, will be two 25-bed general wards. Lastly, on what is termed level five - I suppose that one could call it the roof - will be plant operating equipment and the airconditioning. The building is approximately 15,000 square metres. Excavation has commenced so that building work can start and the new entrance for the emergency department has been installed.

Mr Schultz: What sort of grass seed are they using on the lawn?

Mr SULLIVAN: There are builders huts and offices on the front lawn. The honourable member should have no concern about the lawns. We will worry about grass seed after 1997. Wollongong Hospital is prepared to forgo beautiful lawns so that construction can commence. I am sure that I speak for the people who have served on the hospital board since the 1970s and the staff who have put up with atrocious conditions at the hospital for so long. An amount of $632,000 has been allocated for estuary management in Lake Illawarra. The additional allocation of almost two-thirds of $1 million will allow the excellent management practices to continue. A major task is the maintenance of a permanent entrance to the lake. Research is expected to be completed within a year or so. One of the difficulties is that the mean level of the lake is about 20 centimetres higher than mean sea level. About half the lake is less than one metre deep. A major opening would expose mud flats in shallow sections of the lake. The need to keep the lake open as a flood mitigation measure for low-lying areas and to replenish its water must be balanced so that the permanent water level does not fall to mean sea level, which would expose major areas.

I took great delight in the allocation of $630,000 earlier this financial year for additions to Wollongong fire station, an excellent project. At last Wollongong will have fire-fighting equipment that can reach the highest point of any building or any part of the steelworks plant or gas plant should a fire occur at those sites. The aerial platform in Wollongong will be housed at the station, and an improvement to the environment will result from the provision at the station of facility to prevent suds and muck from the washing of vehicles going into stormwater drains. That refuse will be cleaned before it is released from the facility. In addition, facilities are to be provided for the staff at the Wollongong fire station. For the Port Kembla port itself, $100,000 is allocated for the continuation of site remediation on the outer harbour, together with $650,000 for minor works.

Because of time constraints I will not detail the specifics of that allocation; I will return to do that at a later time because I know Opposition members are keen to hear how much a hard-working local member can achieve while his party is in government. I will enunciate that later if I have time. The next matter I mention is the allocation to Illawarra Electricity, totalling $5.075 million, for new works, some of which I will mention now. Those works are centred in Coniston. The Wollongong electorate is divided by the steelworks and therefore tends to have twin hearts. Coniston is in the northern heart. Part of that allocation, $140,000, will go towards refurbishing levels three and four of the engineering services section of the Coniston administration building. Another allocation is for seed capital for the southern renewable energy project, in the sum of $120,000, as well as an allocation of $180,000 for new computer equipment.

There is a further allocation of $61,000 as a contingency to purchase new technology in computer equipment, and $200,000 for the corporate licence for the Sybase relational database. Other computer equipment allocations include $105,000 for trading software, including a power PC. Much of the new works allocation is associated with office facilities, but $250,000 is allocated for consumer meters, $304,000 is allocated for consumer services in the Coniston district, $924,000 is allocated for distribution mains and substations, and so on. Under that heading is $27,000 for engineering capitalisation of wages, 13 per cent of which is to be spent in the electorate, although the item centres on Coniston. The other allocations that I have mentioned are fully allocated to Wollongong or Coniston projects. There is an allocation for capitalisation of Mincom engineering development expenses of $414,000, and $100,000 for enhancements of Mincom reporting for management.

For Wollongong City Council lighting requests and replacement of unserviceable fittings throughout the area there is an allocation of $150,000. An allocation of $160,000 is made for vehicles suitable for tree lopping operations. That is part of the list of major new investments by the Government in the power system in the Illawarra, centring on Coniston and Wollongong. There are also some minor works, for which the total allocation is $326,000.
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Major works to be funded by the allocation for Illawarra Electricity include $804,000 for distribution transformers, pole replacements, stores and so on. That is a major program of upgrading within Illawarra Electricity, which is now temporarily designated as metropolitan south as a result of its merger with Prospect Electricity. I think there will be considerable benefits to the Illawarra as a result of that merger, particularly in the creation of jobs, Illawarra being an area with high unemployment.

Landcom will undertake new developmental work in subdivisions in the Illawarra totalling $12.66 million. That is a good sign, given the continuing need in the Illawarra for additional residential accommodation as a result of the growth still occurring in that area. Sydney Water will be installing fines screens at the Port Kembla sewage plant, at a cost of $1.46 million. This is another major benefit for the Illawarra because the Port Kembla sewage treatment plant is probably the oldest in the Illawarra and the most likely to cause ongoing problems through not meeting standards of outflow. Of course we have the new major sewage treatment plant at Coniston, but the plant at Port Kembla needs upgrading. In respect of housing allocations, five new one-bedroom dwellings at Berkeley North are to be built for older persons, at a cost of $366,000.

I am pleased that the Department of Housing has virtually ceased constructing bed-sitters because that type of accommodation seems to create as many problems as it solves. Many people find bed-sitter accommodation difficult to live in. In Wollongong, 16 two-bedroom general category dwellings will be built at a cost of $1.931 million. Another allocation for Wollongong relates to two three-bedroom dwellings for the housing of Aboriginals, at a cost of $360,000. That is a substantial continuation of a program that I have supported. It provides housing for those in the community who are unable to provide for themselves. It is important that the budget provides for a major lift in funding for housing maintenance and upgrading in the south eastern region, with $9.612 million being made available for maintenance of properties and $7.232 million being allocated for capital improvements for existing housing stock.

I am very pleased with that allocation of $7.232 million because in that area some houses are old, approaching 40 and 50 years of age. There is a need for major upgrading of those houses, not only from the point of view of the visual impact but also in order to bring that housing stock to standards that we expect at the end of the twentieth century and the beginning of the twenty-first century. As well, $2.922 million is allocated for a number of special upgrading programs. They include fire and safety, $50,000; cement roof replacement, $1.114 million; security, fencing, lighting and doors, $475,000; housing for Aboriginals upgrading, $500,000; and bed-sitter conversions, $783,000. That funding will bring further major benefits for the Illawarra in general and Wollongong electorate in particular. I now move to the roads allocation. When $44 million is to be spent on roads in the Illawarra and Wollongong electorates, that is a major turnaround. The total allocation is $7.087 million for Wollongong. I will run through some of those items. An allocation of $2.2 million is made for major development works on the F6 freeway widening from the intersection of Mount Ousley Road with the F6 Northern Distributor through to the Ghost Creek bridge at Figtree.

There is an allocation for the traffic signals at the Ghost Creek interchange at Figtree, which has already been installed, of $320,000; a right turn bay at Corrimal and Burelli streets, on which work has not yet started, for which the allocation is $285,000; a $40,000 allocation for F6 freeway offloads at Five Islands Road for traffic signal modification; $100,000 for new traffic signals at The Avenue and Cleverdon Crescent, Figtree, which also provides a second entry to Westfield from The Avenue; $50,000 for a directional signal upgrade on Shellharbour Road; $100,000 for new traffic signals at Throsby and Denison streets; $50,000 for the construction of a roundabout at Kembla and Campbell streets; and $816,000 for other minor works. For planning and route development there is an allocation of $285,000, for restoration works $391,000, and for general maintenance $2.298 million. Those are all very good, appropriate and much-needed works in the Illawarra. State Rail will install additional sidings for one-spot wagon maintenance at Port Kembla, at a cost of $428,000. In education approximately $750,000 has been allocated for a major cyclical maintenance program at Warrawong Primary School. Fundamentally this means that $125 million has been allocated for new projects in the Illawarra. [Time expired.]

Mr SOURIS (Upper Hunter - Deputy Leader of the National Party) [10.10]: As shadow minister for roads and public works and finance, I wish to respond to the first budget of the Labor Carr Government. Until March this year the people of New South Wales benefited from seven years of a government which was responsible for the greatest road building and roads system rebuilding program since Federation. It is relevant to recall the appalling state of our roads system after 12 years of Labor neglect. Dirt highways, potholed roads and unsafe intersections were a direct result of a government which would only spend a portion of the taxes it ripped from the income of motorists on our roads system.

In 1988 the people of this State were crying out for a government that understood that there is a direct link between the quality of our infrastructure and economic prosperity, and quality of life. Upon our election the coalition increased road funding to include all of the 3.5¢ fuel levy and introduced the highly successful 3 x 3 fuel levy, which was spent exclusively on roadworks. The list of our roadbuilding projects is impressive and includes the
Page 2316
commencement of the Sydney arterial system, the upgrading of major interstate and intrastate links and the rebuilding of local roads. The coalition also ensured that 60 per cent of all funds raised by the fuel levy was spent in country New South Wales because it was there that the years of Labor disdain had had the most dramatic effect. It is a fact that country New South Wales has more kilometres of roads than do metropolitan areas. Further, rural areas have a significant lack of public transport - unlike the Sydney area - and consequently have a greater dependence on roads.

Even the Labor Government's budget papers reveal that the coalition's period in government saw an unprecedented increase in road construction. This is a legacy of which we are proud and one that will be increasingly difficult for the Labor Government to live up to. The Minister for Roads has stated that the recent roads budget represents an increase of 5 per cent on the coalition's last budget. Certainly Budget Paper No. 3 indicates that the budget of the Roads and Traffic Authority has increased from $1.898 billion to $1.994 billion. Budget Paper No. 4 tells a radically different story, however. Last financial year the coalition spent $434 million on major road building in this State. This year the Labor Government will spend $370 million on road building - an overall reduction of 14.5 per cent. As I will demonstrate later, Labor's lies on the tollways have cost the whole State, and led to a reduction in the number of new roads in this State.

Mr Jeffery: Are you fudging the figures?

Mr SOURIS: I have got five pages of figures. The deception must stop there. In the last year of the coalition Government, 66 per cent of new road building was carried out in country areas. The Labor Party explicitly endorsed this ratio, probably because it recognised the massive rural roads funding deficit it created during its disastrous term in government. The ALP policy for roads released in March of this year promised to maintain the existing rural road construction and maintenance programs. And in a press release dated just 16 days before the election the then shadow minister for transport and now the Carr Government's "fall guy" said:

The 60/40 rural/city split on spending will be maintained under a Carr Government.

Mr O'Farrell: Who said that?

Mr SOURIS: The fall guy, the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism, the Hon. Brian Langton. That was a blatant lie. In Labor's first budget the road building ratio is something like 48:52 in favour of the Sydney metropolitan area. Road building in regional areas of New South Wales has been slashed by a massive $107 million - a reduction of 37.5 per cent! This is the beginning of the return to the bad old days for country roads. Only the naive or the foolhardy would believe that this Labor Government will be any different from the last. The Minister for Public Works and Services, Minister for the Olympics, and Minister for Roads will become the Laurie Brereton of the Carr Government.

There are various reasons for this funding deficit. One of the first actions that this Labor Government took upon coming to power was to radically broaden the nature of the projects to which the 3 x 3 levy can now apply. Of this year's roads budget, a massive $35 million has been siphoned off to pay for what the Government calls public transport infrastructure. The commitment of all road taxes to roadworks - the hypothecation - is no longer. It will not surprise the House to hear that this is but one of the growing list of Labor's broken promises - a list so extensive that the Opposition now has to maintain a computer database to keep up with them. In the now notorious press release of 9 March 1995 the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism said " . . . all funds raised by the 3 x 3 will be hypothecated to roads . . . " - another blatant lie.

The coalition's record in government shows that it is committed to a world-class public transport system, and we support the continued development of public transport infrastructure. What we vehemently oppose is the use of road funds for non-road projects. The Labor Party has been forced into this situation in order to pay for its irresponsible and dishonest election promises. The car park levy introduced by the Greiner-Murray Government to fund the sorts of public transport infrastructure projects that the levy is now going to seems to be resting very comfortably in consolidated revenue. Upon our return to government we will repeal those sections of the Road Improvement (Special Funding) Act which allow this siphoning. The coalition will return to roads the taxes derived from road users.

I have mentioned reduced road funding and some of the reasons for it, and it is important to recognise the impact that these cuts will have on specific road projects around the State. Budget Paper No. 4 shows that almost 50 projects around the State, totalling more than $1 billion, have been cut. The majority of these projects have already had a significant amount of funds committed to them - more than $124 million, by my calculations. What a waste of taxpayers' funds. I ask the Minister what will become of these discontinued projects. Are they now any less important than they were last year? Are road improvements to be left half finished, or bridges to be left only half spanning rivers? Expensive design work already done on these projects will never be dusted off if the projects happen to re-appear on the forward program; it will be done again.

I put the Minister on notice that the coalition will raise these questions during the estimates committees hearings. Of the 47 discontinued projects, 12 are in the Sydney metropolitan area, five in Newcastle, two in Wollongong, one on the
Page 2317
central coast and 22 in regional areas. My colleagues have already mentioned some of the specific cutbacks in their electorates. Nine significant improvements to the Hume Highway worth $275 million have been discontinued. Only three major works, worth $33.5 million, on the highway will proceed this year, leaving a backlog of work on the country's most significant interstate link. I said that the Opposition is forced to keep on a database a list of the ALP's election promises in order to keep up with how many it has broken.

This database tells us much about the various road projects all around New South Wales that were promised in the lead-up to the election, which Labor now hopes have been forgotten. For example, the upgrading of the Newcastle to Dubbo link is an important project, and is of particular interest to me as the member for the Upper Hunter. The Labor Party thought that it was so important that it promised it in three different policies. Imagine my surprise when I discovered that there is no additional funding in this year's budget for this project. The country suffers yet again. The list of broken promises goes on - the toll-free eastern distributor, the Queanbeyan bypass, the new link from Port Macquarie to the Pacific Highway and the upgrading of the Pacific Highway over the Burringbar Range. In 1991 the National Roads and Motorists Association stated:

. . . the Pacific Highway has regularly demonstrated the worst features and the worst crash records. It has also had more black spots than any other highway in New South Wales. Its problems are so entrenched that when known black spots are corrected, more appear elsewhere.

On budget day the Minister for Roads issued a press release saying that the Government had honoured its promise on the Pacific Highway by allocating $106 million this financial year. What the Minister neglected to say is that seven projects worth $121 million have been discontinued. The only new project that this Government will commence on the Pacific Highway is the Murwillumbah to Chinderah duplication. All other Pacific Highway works were commenced by the coalition. The cancellation of the $6 billion Motorway Pacific project may well prove to be the most infamous action by this Labor Government. That project would have provided a new divided highway between Newcastle and the Queensland border within the next 10 years. According to the NRMA, at the Labor Party's current rate of spending it will be 40 years before this important route is a dual carriageway. And, unfortunately, over this time many thousands more will be killed or injured. The facts speak for themselves - the Pacific Highway will continue to be a national disgrace until the Australian Labor Party Government commits itself either to expenditure of at least $400 million a year for 10 years or to Motorway Pacific. Until such time the Government will have blood on its hands.

The promise to lift the tolls on the M4 and the M5 was always breathtakingly cynical, economically irresponsible and environmentally unjustifiable. It was a promise made never to be kept. One can picture the disappointment of the Labor Party upon coming to government only to find that the coalition had left the State in much too good a position for it to use the old "the cupboard is bare" line. On the fiftieth anniversary of victory in the Pacific, the Government tried to wriggle out of its iron-clad, guaranteed promise by saying, "But you should have told us how much our promise was going to cost." Suddenly the promise that was to have cost over $70 million a year for the next 30 years was converted to an extra $73 million a year for four years. The promise that the Labor Party had made to alleviate the toll to the extent of $70 million for 30 years has been replaced by a few replacement projects for only four years, which is a massive deceit and yet another promise waiting to be broken.

The Government continues to rub salt into the wounds of the motorists of western and south-western Sydney. However, a closer look at last week's budget statements shows that the Government's much-heralded western Sydney roads and transport program is another lie - nothing more than a trick done with mirrors. Of the 27 road projects in Sydney's west, only 12 are new. One of them is the widening of the M4 between Parramatta and Penrith. I have the benefit of another pearl of wisdom from the Minister for Transport, who on 16 November 1994, when he was the shadow minister for transport, issued a press release titled "Labor's Roads Program Fully Costed" - a joke in itself - in which he said, "as for the widening of the M4, I and millions of taxpayers would like to know why Mr Baird thinks we should pay for its widening when it is a privately owned tollway." What an embarrassment. It is no wonder that the Minister for Transport wanted to resign; the only surprise is that his colleagues did not encourage him.

The total cost of the new works in Sydney's west and south-west is $37.5 million, well short of the promised $73 million - quite apart from the number of years for which the promise was made. Many of these are the pet projects of the Minister for Roads, such as the Leumeah Road rail overbridge, which in 1990 was the subject of a tirade in the House by the then factionally confused member for Campbelltown. All other projects were commenced by the coalition during its time in office. The Government will no doubt argue that it is spending increased funds on these already announced projects, yet at least $21.5 million of those projects is Federal money, committed as part of the western Sydney orbital project. I made these figures public last week, and the Minister for Roads has not denied them. When this is taken into consideration along with the slashing of roads projects on the north shore, up and down the coast and throughout the bush, it is clear that the entire State is paying for Labor's promises and Labor's lies.

I was very pleased to read last week's press release of the Minister for Roads titled "Motor Registries win prestigious customer service award".
Page 2318
In that release the Minister detailed the various improvements undertaken by the Roads and Traffic Authority in customer service that led to it receiving an award from the Australian Customer Service Association. The Minister neglected to mention that it was the coalition that initiated and drove those reforms. I am therefore concerned to read in Budget Paper No. 3 that there is to be a reduction of almost 500 in the estimated full-time staff numbers. An allowance of $40.1 million has been made to meet these redundancies. To date there has been no indication of where the cuts are to be made. Can the Minister assure the House that there will be no reduction in customer services as a result of the cuts? I doubt that he can. I draw the attention of the House to table 4.7 in Budget Paper No. 2, which forecasts a reduction in pensioner drivers licence concessions from $29.9 million in 1994-95 to $18.2 million this year, a reduction of 40 per cent.

There is no explanation in the budget papers for the reduction, and I imagine that the Minister would be happy to leave it that way. However, the coalition will raise that question in the estimates committee to ensure that those in the community least able to defend themselves are not suffering the brunt of Labor lies. I turn briefly now to the assumptions that underlie this first Labor Government budget, because the forward program for roads relies heavily on the budgetary position in the coming years. The budget is based on New South Wales achieving a growth rate of 3.7 per cent, when most economic commentators forecast a national growth rate of 3.2 per cent. The Government assumes an inflation rate of 4.3 per cent, which seems to take no heed of the wage claims presently in the pipeline.

The Government predicts an 8 per cent increase in government revenue and a $184 million increase in unidentified asset sales and other property income. The motorists of this State are hostage to these optimistic forecasts and if they do not eventuate, the roads budget will suffer even more than it has this year. I mentioned at the beginning of my speech that this was the Carr Government's first fiscal test. What, then, is the result? I would say that it is a very poor effort. Especially dangerous was the poorly executed three-point turn on the tollway, which has caused much damage to road users. The Carr Government also had a tendency to only half complete roads. Other low points were country driving skills, due to the driver of the Carr Government having absolutely no idea what the Government is doing or where it is going in the country. Overall, Opposition members give this first budget of the Carr Labor Government a C-minus.

Mr RUMBLE (Illawarra) [10.29]: Both the Premier and the Treasurer should be congratulated on introducing this responsible and fair budget, which has been very well received in the community. It seeks to reduce the deficit in 1995-96 to $238 million, compared with $323 million in 1994-95. The budget provides for an $11 million surplus in the 1996-97 year, with no new taxes or increases in existing taxes. The health budget is up by more than $240 million to $5.49 billion, compared with $5.25 billion in 1994-95. Three new hospitals will be provided, and $64 million will be spent on halving the public hospital waiting list. The police budget is up $50 million to $1.3 billion. An additional 650 police will be employed over a two-year period, $6.8 million will be provided to the Victims Crime Bureau and $2.1 million will be spent on bullet-proof vests for police. The education budget is up by $5 million to $272 million. Over a two-year period 5,000 new TAFE places will be created, 339 new teachers will be appointed and five new schools will be established. An amount of $86 million has been allocated for computers and technology.

The community services budget is up by $157 million to $1.1 billion. Over three years 60 additional child protection workers will be employed and 13,000 child-care places will be created. The transport budget is up by $24 million to $1.52 billion. An amount of $907 million will be spent on roads and the $10 charge on country rail trips for pensioners will be abolished. In the area of law and order the response time for police calls will be halved with the employment of an additional 650 police officers. The Government aims to keep fine defaulters out of gaol, impose tougher sentences on those who commit serious crimes and provide a better deal for victims of crime. After seven years of the previous Government the Illawarra region has done very well under this budget. The previous Government actually discriminated against the Illawarra.

The previous Government closed Tallawarra power station and the Huntley colliery, abandoned work on the Maldon to Dombarton line, closed Department of Community Services offices and Department of Housing offices and took a host of other decisions to the detriment of the people of the Illawarra region. This Government has allocated $125 million for capital works programs in 1995-96. An amount of $44 million - an increase of 12 per cent - will be spent on road projects and, over the next two years, $6 million will be spent on the Wollongong sports and entertainment complex. An amount of $11.5 million will be spent on health services. The clinical services block at Wollongong hospital will be completed, which is in stark contrast to the previous Government's stop-go, lackadaisical attitude towards that project. At one stage the previous Government said that the completion of the project would go ahead, but after 12 or 18 months all that could be seen at the site was a big black hole. This Government will finish off the job.

[Interruption]

The former member for Northcott was more urbane than the current member. An amount of $2 million has been allocated to construct noise
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pollution barriers on the F6 in the Illawarra electorate, between Kanahooka Road and Mount Brown Road. Over the last 12 months we had Buckley's chance of extracting that amount of money from the previous Government. It just did not want to spend money on the Illawarra region. On behalf of the citizens of Dapto I thank the Minister for Transport for allocating that amount of money. An amount of $50,000 will be spent on the first stage of the new automotive and heavy vehicle training facility at Shellharbour TAFE and a total of $5.7 million will be spent by June 1997. Another great initiative of this Government is the allocation of $320,000 towards noise pollution abatement work on the railway line from Unanderra to Moss Vale.

Over the last few years I have received a number of complaints about the noise pollution from that railway line. The previous Government did nothing to address this problem. I continually received a lot of negative letters from the former Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Transport which stated that the matter was being investigated, that consultants were looking into it and that the consultants would complete their report at a certain date. I would then receive letters from the Minister to the effect that they were still looking at the problem. The former Government had a lackadaisical attitude towards this project. However, when I raised the matter with the new Minister for Transport, he put a bomb underneath the department, and we are now getting some action. Surveys were conducted in the Farmborough Heights area. People in that locality were asked for their opinions on a solution to this problem. Freight Rail organised a public meeting. Under this Government the State Rail Authority is showing genuine concern in relation to the issue. Under the previous Administration nothing was achieved; there was only a lot of waffle.

In Dapto and Unanderra respectively, new housing units worth $1.6 million have been approved. I was disappointed that no money was allocated in this budget for work on the Maldon to Dombarton line. As I said earlier, the previous Government abandoned work on that line after it had specifically promised to continue that project. That was but one of the 200 promises broken by the previous Government. In 1987-88, when that project was going full steam ahead, the tunnel project was abandoned - another of the broken promises of the previous Government. This railway line will be used for the transportation of freight and to provide relief for the main Illawarra railway line, which is experiencing instability problems because of the number of freight trains from the western districts of New South Wales using the line to Port Kembla. The completion of the Maldon to Dombarton line will not only take pressure off the Illawarra line; it will upgrade Port Kembla to a major port.

A lot has been said about the broken promises of this Government. I have evidence of 19 broken promises of the Leader of the Opposition. The Leader of the Opposition, as Minister for the Arts, said in a Liberal Party policy speech, "Existing funding schemes for both recurrent and capital purposes . . . will be maintained." As a result of action taken by the previous Government the New South Wales Film Corporation was abolished and the former Government announced reductions in certain arts grants in its 1989 budget. The Minister responsible for that broken promise was the former Minister for the Arts, the Hon. Peter Collins. However, it should be said that the former honourable member for Northcott held the record for broken promises.

Mr Debus: He was in an Olympic class.

Mr RUMBLE: He was the leader of the pack. I suspect that the present honourable member for Northcott, who was a member of the staff of the former honourable member, was most probably a conspirator in a lot of those broken promises. The Sydney Morning Herald, in an article on 26 February 1988, reported the Liberal spokesman for health, Mr Collins, as saying:

The Coalition Parties support moving the Department of Health from the City centre to Parramatta.

On 4 July the former Minister for Health announced that the department would remain in the McKell Building. The Minister responsible for the broken promise was the former Minister for Health, Mr Collins. On 4 July 1988 the former Minister for Health announced that the department would remain in the McKell Building, Sydney. However, the Department of Health was moved to North Sydney at a cost of $11 million. The Minister responsible for the broken promise again was the former Minister for Health, Mr Collins. I have evidence of the 200 promises that were broken by the former Government. It is a bit rich for Opposition members to pretend they are lilywhite in regard to broken promises.

I turn now to law and order. After watching media reports on television and reading newspapers I have established that victims and their families who have had violence perpetrated against them are outraged, and rightly so, at the grossly inadequate sentences being given to criminals by bleeding-heart magistrates and judges. On the other hand, members of the judiciary are whingeing about their independence being infringed. To complicate matters, the Director of Public Prosecutions is buying into the act. Prior to the last State election a newspaper report stated:

When the ALP moved to increase the stakes in the law and order debate yesterday, Mr Cowdery held a joint press conference with the head of the Law Society, Mr Maurie Stack and the Bar Association president, Mr Murray Tobias QC.

Mr Cowdery said that while the Parliament made laws, it was up to lawyers and judges to cope with them and mandatory life sentences had been a "failure" in other jurisdictions that had introduced them.

I am amazed. I thought the job of the Director of Public Prosecutions was to prosecute criminals, not to go to press conferences with those responsible for
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defending criminals or to enter into political debate by commenting on government policy. The Director of Public Prosecutions has issued a strong plea to the Government and to the New South Wales Labor Party: "Stop the auction on law and order and stop it now." I make the non-political comment that all major parties must be receiving representations from people who are sick and tired of a lot of pussy-footing magistrates and judges giving themselves a warm inner glow by passing inadequate sentences on people who commit crimes of violence. Comments have been made that the judiciary must have independence, that the Government is sticking its nose in and telling judges what they should and should not do. In the Sydney Morning Herald on 20 March the Director of Public Prosecutions was quoted as having said:

Judges already have the sentencing tools. There is no need for ill-advised new tools.

This House has passed laws prescribing maximum sentences for violent criminals, including home invaders. When I have asked some of my lawyer associates what they thought about legislating for a minimum sentence their attitude has been that the Government cannot do that; it can set maximum sentences but it is up to the court and the judges to fix minimum sentences because there could be extenuating circumstances. There must be many extenuating circumstances as far as criminals are concerned. Under the so-called independence of the judiciary it has been reported that for the serious crime of break, enter and steal the maximum sentence is 20 years gaol if the offender is armed, but the average prison term imposed is 2 years and 3 months.

For the offence of supplying a prohibited plant the maximum penalty is 20 years to life and the average prison term is 2 years. For the offence of armed robbery the maximum penalty is 20 years and the average prison term 4 years and 1 month. For robbery the maximum penalty is 14 years and the average prison term 2 years and 6 months. For indecent assault offences the maximum penalty is 4 years, with the average prison term being 18 months. Instead of judges whingeing and grizzling about their independence they should reflect the attitudes of the community. The victims of crime and their relatives hope that judges will carry out their jobs in a more appropriate way. The criminal lawyers are only interested in the big bucks. Judges are in it for the warm inner glow they get from saying "You have been a naughty boy, but you have every chance of being rehabilitated. I will give you 5 per cent of the maximum sentence."

In the celebrated case of the hoodlums who broke into a family home and received a term of five years, the Director of Public Prosecutions still maintains that the sentence was adequate. The Director of Public Prosecutions may be a little confused. He appears to think that he is the public defender. He is not the public defender; he is the Director of Public Prosecutions. I will give other examples of where judges and magistrates have stuck their noses into things. A report in the Illawarra Mercury relating to the backpacker murders - and I shall not mention any names - referred to the Attorney General's comment that the judge had ruled beyond the judiciary's power and had set a precedent for a multimillion blow-out in legal aid spending. [Extension of time agreed to.]

In addition to some judges giving grossly inadequate sentences, they are also sticking their noses into legal aid matters. I shall mention several examples that have come to my notice. A 19-year-old Lake South man who king-hit an off-duty policeman during a fight inside a nightclub was sentenced to 150 hours of community service. A Southern Highlands farmer was sentenced to a minimum term of three months gaol after a Wollongong District Court jury convicted him of aggravated indecent assault of a 13-year-old boy. A 50-year-old father who complained that his son was playing music too loudly was repeatedly kicked and punched and his head bashed into a wall. The offender was sentenced to a total of 150 hours of community service on the assault and resisting arrest charges and was fined $200 for offensive language.

As the Minister is in the House, I mention that I have received complaints about people not complying with community service orders. A Balgownie teenager who sexually assaulted a 13-year-old girl was sentenced to nine months in a juvenile detention centre. The court heard that there had been a high degree of physical violence and that the 17-year-old had punched a detective in the face at Corrimal on 4 March after police attempted to arrest him for the sexual assault committed on 27 January. The detective was forced to seek hospital treatment. The magistrate found the youth guilty of all charges and ordered him to enter into a sexual offenders program. However, the sentence imposed was nine months to be served in a juvenile detention centre.

Some people make excuses for criminals, especially in regard to the connection between intoxication and criminal responsibility. I will not say much about this subject, except to draw a contrast between the matters to which I have referred and a case involving a person who gets into a car when drunk. One is either drunk or not drunk, and in the latter instance if a person is caught driving when drunk, he will be convicted, and will face the full force of the law. Why should there be extenuating circumstances when someone is drunk and commits a murder or a rape? However, the civil libertarians and the do-gooders make excuses for criminals. A judge in Victoria convicted a person of murder. The accused stood mute during both trials. The judge commented:

In my opinion, the time has arrived when a trial judge should be empowered to comment to the jury upon the failure of an accused to give evidence on oath.

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The judge invited the Victorian Attorney-General to take action on his comments. The point the judge made was that people accused of crimes do not have to give evidence at their trial. My understanding is that anyone called before a royal commission who refuses to answer questions will be put in the clink until he or she is prepared to answer the questions. The Government has a package of progressive reforms which include: the power for victims to request that a victim's impact statement be prepared to ensure that the judge or magistrate is aware of the full effect of the crime upon the victim; measures to ensure that victims are kept fully informed of every step of the criminal justice system, including the progress of investigation of the crime, the charges laid or reasons for not laying the charges, or any decision not to proceed with charges; victims will be entitled to an explanation of the outcome of criminal proceedings and any other sentence imposed and be protected from any unnecessary contact with the accused and defence witnesses during the proceedings.

The abolition of dock statements, which were introduced in England hundreds of years ago to protect those who were illiterate and who could not defend themselves, caused a furore amongst the legal fraternity. Dock statements provided the opportunity for such people to get up and say something without being subject to cross-examination. In modern times dock statements have been used only by murderers and rapists so that they could get up in court and lie their heads off without being subject to cross-examination. Obviously the abolition of dock statements went a long way towards improving the balance between the rights of victims and the rights of the accused. Society has always had people running around championing the causes of the accused, but it is only recently - for example at the seminar held in Parliament House last night with the group Enough is Enough - that the scales gradually have become more balanced so that victims and their families have been able to put forward their points of view and gain some recognition in the community. The budget is a very responsible one. It certainly assists people in the Illawarra region, who have been discriminated against for the last seven or eight years. I look forward to the other budgets of the Carr Labor Government.

Mr SMALL (Murray) [10.51]: Since my election to Parliament in 1985 this is the eleventh occasion on which I have spoken in debate on a State budget. I spoke to three budgets from 1985-87 when the previous Labor Government was in power, the last seven budgets of the former coalition Government brought down between 1988 and 1995, and the budget brought down by the Labor Government for the period 1995-1996. This year I have observed some of the most dramatic changes in my 11 years in this House. Unfortunately, there has been a lack of consultation with many country areas in my electorate, but I am pleased to note that the Treasurer has identified projects that were previously approved for funding, even though the completion times for those projects have been spread over a longer period.

Let me begin my contribution by speaking about education. Funding for the Lockhart Central school, which was approved in the last 12 months of the former Government, will continue. During the 1995-96 budget period the school will receive $1,431,000 for improvements including a gym, extra classrooms, additional facilities and a library. The Lockhart Central school now has years 11 and 12 students. I am pleased to note that the remaining $310,000 will be included in the 1996-97 budget and, of course, $150,000 was spent on planning and preparation in the previous year's budget. I am disappointed that within the 67 schools in my electorate, 55 of which are government schools, three other schools - the Barham high school, the Hay War Memorial high school and the Deniliquin North public school - are in need of a multipurpose-type facility. Though much pressure has been placed on the department and the Government to provide funding for those schools, they are not mentioned in this budget. I sincerely hope that next year, or certainly in the very near future, they can be included in budgetary programs to assist students and teachers at those schools.

I am unhappy about many of the structural changes to education, particularly the changed responsibilities of cluster directors who now have to administer much larger numbers of schools. Most of the changes that occurred recently have been subjected to further change. There is no doubt that during the early days of the coalition Government education changed dramatically, and I admit that the changes occurred rapidly. However, the policies were right and they have been working successfully. I hope that not too many dramatic changes occur because education needs a settling period, particularly for students who are working towards years nine and 10 to sit for the school certificate, and students in years 11 and 12 who sit for the higher school certificate. It is upsetting for teachers and students to continually encounter change. Education is an important area in which I have a vital interest. I have ridden to the 67 schools in my electorate promoting, particularly, the Olympic Games in the year 2000.

I should now like to turn to health. The Urana multipurpose health facility has been completed and will be officially opened by the Minister for Health. It is one of the first four multipurpose health centres in New South Wales, funded with the assistance of the Federal Government, and includes excellent facilities including aged-care facilities, acute-care beds, emergency beds and an ambulance. It is a boost for small towns in which aged care has never been properly catered for. I acknowledge the good work of the former Minister, who worked with the Federal Government to ensure the completion of that facility. The present Minister for Health has acknowledged that the multipurpose health facility at the Wentworth Hospital will proceed as agreed.
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That is good news. The project is not identified in the budget program, although the Minister has signalled its approval. For the last three or four years its approval has been on the drawing board. It is a matter of obtaining final support from the Federal Government in conjunction with the State Government. I do not know whether the New South Wales Government is waiting for Federal Government approval of the funding for construction of that health facility in the 1995-96 budgetary year.

Such multipurpose health centres are of vital importance, particularly in the Sunraysia area of Wentworth. I am concerned about the restructuring of the health system. The Murray regional health board, which was set up only two years ago and which covers eight of my 12 hospitals, is doing a good job. I am concerned that there could be massive changes and that regional health boards such as the Wagga Wagga area health board, the Albury area health board, and the Murray area health may be done away with. Hospital boards continue to play a very important role, although recently their roles have been diminished with the advent of the regional boards. I should like to think that local people could continue to represent the needs of local hospitals. It would be tragic if regional boards, established only two years ago, were done away with. Health and education are important issues, particularly in isolated country areas.

This year's budget allocates $22.923 million to national and regional roads in the Murray electorate, including funding provided from the 3 x 3 program. That allocation, however, is $10 million less than the $32.8 million funding provided last year for roads in the electorate. I am deeply concerned about that huge funding cutback. I concede that the allocation of almost $23 million, by comparison with allocations in many other electorates, seems a lot of money. But the Murray electorate covers about 93,000 square kilometres and, if fitted into Victoria, would cover about 40 per cent of that State. The electorate has a huge road network which includes the major Sturt, Newell and Cobb national highways and the regional Riverina and Silver City highways. An amount of $9.133 million has been allocated this year for national highways in the electorate, $7.223 million for State roads, and $6.567 million for regional roads - a total of $22.923 million.

Country members are worried about reclassification under the 3 x 3 program. I am pleased that the Government has introduced a 3 x 4 arrangement, that is, three cents per litre over a four-year period. Unfortunately, the 60:40 ratio has been taken away, under which 60 per cent of 3 x 3 funds went on country roads and 40 per cent went to the metropolitan area. Distribution of those funds is determined on a needs basis. But my concern, echoed by the 13 councils in the Murray electorate, is that distribution is made according to identification of needs. If needs are identified on a population basis, country areas are in trouble, and metropolitan areas would win handsomely. I hope that does not occur, and that the Government and the Minister determine that those funds are to be shared throughout the State according to the need for roads and not population-based needs. I would be pleased to hear from the Minister about it.

A proportion of funds will be siphoned off for gazetted bus roads, cycle storage areas and parking areas. Funds that could be allocated to country roads are being lost to other purposes. I hope that the placement of 3 x 3 funds is adjusted to enhance the needs of country people. I congratulate Matt Singleton, one of the forefathers of the 3 x 3 program, for introducing that idea under the Greiner-Murray Government. The Cobb Highway action group has done a marvellous job on that road north from Hay through to Ivanhoe. Roads in that heavy soil area, unsurfaced and with little formation to them for most of their length, are like dirt tracks. That highway has been closed up to 53 times in a year, even when light rain falls in the area. Work on the Cobb Highway has been recognised as a priority. During the last five years a wonderful sealing program has been under way on that road, particularly from Booligal to Mossgiel, with work to be continued up to Ivanhoe. This year about $500,000 will be spent on the road north of Mossgiel and $900,000 will be spent north of Booligal - a most pleasing item in the budget.

Under the public works 1995-96 budget six shires will receive allocations in 12 areas of funding, particularly for water filtration and sewerage works. Those shires are known and identified, but the total allocation is only $3.1 million - a huge cut in funds compared with those made available the previous year. The budgeted amounts have been expanded over perhaps another two years of construction time. That extension will cost the taxpayers, through the State, and the ratepayers, through the shires, a lot more money. Inflation always occurs during any extended time period. I am disappointed that the time frame is so much longer, but it is important that the work be done. The shires that will receive development funding this year are Berrigan, Corowa, Deniliquin, Murray, Wentworth and Wakool.

I turn to the irrigation, land and water management programs. The budget makes no allocation for drainage. In previous years, $13 million was allocated to drainage and irrigation development, with about $3.5 million of that amount going towards irrigation in the Berriquin district. This year the budget does not identify any such allocation. To be fair, figures in the budget suggest irrigation packages of $19.4 million and $23.9 million for this State, for repairs to waterways and irrigation facilities. I assume that funding is for land and water management plans within the Berrigan, Wakool, Denimein and Deniboota irrigation areas within the Murray electorate. Irrigators in those areas have worked
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magnificently together to put forward plans and programs for the approval of the previous Government. The present Labor Government has carried through with that funding. There will never be enough funding, but those irrigators are taking positive steps environmentally to be able to correct rising watertables and soil degradation being experienced in some areas. The management program is excellent.

Agriculture, together with water, is very much the backbone of the Murray electorate. I am disappointed that the Minister for Agriculture has identified a $34 million cutback in agriculture funding during the next three years. More recently developed programs of veterinary service research will be lost to both Wagga Wagga and Armidale. It is appalling that there should be any cutback in research. The Rydalmere research station, which houses this State's agricultural research facilities and first-class scientists, is probably the hub of veterinary research in Australia, especially on stock diseases and horticulture. The land at Rydalmere is owned by the Department of Public Works and Services. The CSIRO also has facilities there. I understand that the Federal Government is very annoyed about the proposal to close down the Rydalmere centre because there was no consultation with it.

In 1990 I was chairman of the agriculture committee when recommendations were made that the Rydalmere facilities could be dispersed and re-centred elsewhere with most of the scientists and staff. We examined the facilities. I must confess that we objected strongly to the proposed move, and the facilities remained where they were. However, I am upset and disappointed, as are most residents of rural New South Wales, about the loss of the Rydalmere research station and its research work, which will most likely be picked up by other States such as Victoria, Western Australia and even South Australia. I believe we are being done a great injustice. Rydalmere has played a vital role in research on stock diseases, introduction of special species, and horticultural developments. I would like to think there will be a change of heart and that veterinary services in Wagga Wagga and Armidale will be maintained.

I refer now to the importance of resources such as land, water and forests in my electorate. The Murray River region contains important red gum forests. That area is the fourth-largest river valley in the world, and its resources are of enormous benefit not only to that area but to the State and the nation in exportable earnings. Strict rules have been laid down by State environmental planning policy 46, which cover farming and clearing activities. I can assure those who believe a lot of clearing is taking place in my electorate that there is far more planting of trees than there is clearing. I cannot nominate any areas that are being cleared. It does not do this State or this Government proud to suggest that people are flouting the rules. They are doing a fantastic job looking after the resources and the environment. Tourism is also very important, particularly when one considers the growth in tourism along the Murray River. The competition as a result of the introduction of gambling machines is creating enormous heartache in that area. [Time expired.]

Mr HUNTER (Lake Macquarie) [11.11]: I support the first budget of the Carr Labor Government. The budget has certainly given a boost to many projects in the Lake Macquarie electorate, and I will detail those projects. In the area of education, $100,000 has been allocated for planning of the $4 million upgrade of Toronto high school. Most honourable members would know that about 12 months ago there was a terrible fire at the school. D block was destroyed and fire damage was caused to the upper sections of A block. The insurance cover for that fire damage was in the vicinity of $2 million. That money is being spent and as a result A block has been rehabilitated and construction of a replacement D block, which will be a new science block, should commence in January. The budget has allocated $100,000 for the planned upgrading of the school to a code 1,000 school - one which will cater for 1,000 students. Funding will take place over a number of budgets up to $4 million.

Over a few years an estimated $6 million will be spent on Toronto high school. I have attended a number of on-site meetings at that school in the past nine months. Prior to the March election, Labor committed itself to the upgrade. That commitment is being fulfilled by the allocation of funds in the budget. An amount of $1.4 million has been allocated in the budget for the new Rathmines public school. Those funds will allow the Department of School Education to pay out the current contracts. It will also allow the department to build a new bus bay to improve student safety. Some 15 or 16 demountable buildings will be removed. At one stage the school could have been described as a sea of demountables. The allocation of about $1.4 million in the budget will also be used to remove the demountables and to landscape the area.

Other highlights in the budget include funds from the 3 x 3 program for road safety and traffic management in the Lake Macquarie electorate. The sum of $77,000 has been allocated to improve pedestrian access at the Booragul railway station. Pedestrian lights will be installed on busy Main Road 217, which will improve the safety of students attending a number of high schools and public schools in the area. It is estimated that 28,000 to 30,000 vehicles a day pass the existing pedestrian crossing, and the installation of traffic lights will be a major improvement. The budget also allocates $100,000 under the 3 x 3 program for the construction of a cycleway along The Esplanade from Fairfax Road, Warners Bay to Speers Point Park. The sum of $90,000 has also been allocated under the 3 x 3 program for a cycleway from the Teralba roundabout to Edwards Park at Booragul. Following construction of both these missing links,
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a cycleway will cover a great deal of the northern end of the Lake Macquarie foreshore. The Government should be congratulated for introducing legislation to allow 3 x 3 funds to be allocated for these road safety projects. The amount of $200,000 has been allocated for pavement rehabilitation between the Five Islands bridges at Teralba, and $290,000 for pavement rehabilitation between Victory Parade and Thorne Street, Toronto.

Lake Macquarie City Council will receive approximately $1.4 million for general road maintenance, and almost $1 million for maintenance of regional roads. The Myuna Bay Sport and Recreation Centre in the Lake Macquarie electorate will receive $100,000 for landscaping and site works and $480,000 to construct replacement community lodges. The budget also includes the expenditure of $7.5 million on capital works at Eraring power station. That will mean a major injection of funds into the local west Lake Macquarie area and the creation of many local jobs as a result of contracting to firms who employ local people. The sum of $4.6 million has been allocated for site clearance at the now disused Wangi power station.

State Rail will spend $650,000 to upgrade Morisset station, together with a sum provided by the Federal Government, will bring the total to approximately $1.5 million. The amount of $1.8 million has been allocated for the upgrading of Fassifern railway station, with the installation of lifts, major landscaping, security cameras and security lighting. The small Awaba railway station will not miss out; it will receive $90,000 to complete upgrading work that began some months ago. Under the police portfolio the budget has allocated $500,000 to upgrade Morisset police station. Demountable buildings will be removed and new accommodation provided. The sergeant's residence will be converted and extended and will result in what could be called a new police station for Morisset. The current situation is inadequate. Police work out of two or three demountable buildings which, for occupational health and safety reasons, are not acceptable.

I am pleased that the Minister for Police has listened to the concerns of the local community, which I have raised in this House on many occasions, and has allocated $500,000 to upgrade the police station. The local community and police will benefit from the upgrade, and I congratulate the Minister on his decision to allocate the funds. The budget also provides for the employment of extra police. I hope that over the next 12 months extra police will be allocated to the Toronto patrol, thus raising the level of policing in the west Lake Macquarie area. Prior to the election it was proposed to construct a courthouse at Toronto. Although no funds have been allocated in the budget, I am sure next year funds will be allocated for the planning of a Toronto courthouse. To this end, the Attorney General, the Hon. Jeff Shaw, instructed people from the capital works and strategic services sections of his department to visit Lake Macquarie.

That visit took place on 13 October. We inspected the proposed courthouse site and the local Toronto police station and spoke to people from the property section of the police and the local patrol. We also met representatives of Lake Macquarie City Council and the Toronto Chamber of Commerce to discuss a proposal to relocate the court on a site adjacent to the police station. For some time there has been a problem with the proposed courthouse site in the sense that it is located directly opposite the police station but separated by a four-lane main road, Main Road 217. As I said earlier, some 28,000 to 30,000 vehicles travel on that road each day, and it would be inconvenient for all if the courthouse were built on the other side of the road, opposite the police station. I hope, with the negotiations that are continuing, we will see an acquisition of land adjacent to the police station and an allocations of funds in next year's budget.

The Carr Government's first budget certainly delivers on funding for housing. There is a major increase in capital works funding by almost $35 million, from $503 million to $538 million. That is good news for tenants in the Lake Macquarie electorate. It will improve the prospects for people on waiting lists in the west Lake Macquarie area. Funding has also been directed to community housing projects, which will see community organisations working with the Government to improve greater housing choice. A range of creative and targeted programs will address the housing needs of special community groups. The Minister for Housing announced a grant of some $880,000 for the construction of single dwellings at the Westlakes retired mineworkers village, which will increase the village of six or seven dwellings by an extra nine or 10 dwellings. The grant is certainly going to a worthy community organisation, providing housing for former mineworkers in the west Lake Macquarie area.

Funding for maintenance has also been boosted to enable more effective upkeep of properties. In the first Labor Government budget we have stamped "priority" on a number of key areas and delivered on core services such as housing. The people of my electorate will benefit from the allocation of funds for certain housing projects, and I shall detail them for the House. Under the capital works program, works in progress will see the finalising of the construction of two dwellings in the Booragul area at a cost of some $287,000. The completion date for those properties is April 1996. Under the new works program, nine two-bedroom dwellings will be constructed at Fennell Bay, with a completion date of October 1996, and at a cost of $227,000. At Bonnells Bay a five-bedroom single dwelling will be completed in March next year at a cost of $260,000, and at Carey Bay six one-bedroom pensioner units will be constructed, with completion due for September 1996 at an estimated cost of some $815,000. That will provide a great opportunity for people on the waiting list, particularly pensioners on the western side of Lake Macquarie.

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As for maintenance and upgrading, the budget for the Department of Housing provides $9 million for maintenance of properties and $7 million for capital improvements to existing housing stock in the Hunter region. An additional $1.6 million has been allocated for special upgrading projects in the region, including $180,000 for fire and safety, $270,000 for roof replacement, $100,000 for security fencing, $500,000 for upgrading the housing stock for Aboriginal families and $620,000 for bed-sitter conversions in the next financial year. It is important for people to note that the Department of Housing contributes to our local city councils and water authorities. It is estimated that in the 1995-96 financial year the Department will contribute $1,720,000 to Lake Macquarie City Council and $5,600,000 to Hunter Water Corporation Limited. The State Government is contributing quite a sum to those organisations to provide much better facilities in the local area.

The election of the Carr Government has resulted in major improvements to the health budget. Area and district health services across the State are $129 million better off than they were under the previous Liberal Government. In the Hunter area more than $423 million has been allocated, an increase of $24 million over the previous budget. That represents an increase of 2.1 per cent in real terms. Honourable members will recall that over the past 12 months Labor members from the Hunter region have raised concerns about the level of funding for health services in the region. The Carr Government and the Minister for Health have delivered a major increase in funding for the Hunter region. Additional funds have also been allocated for the waiting list reduction program and the emergency department incentive program. The capital works program for 1995-96 provides $8 million for the Maitland Hospital redevelopment; $1.9 million has been allocated for a new psychiatric unit at Maitland Hospital, and $300,000 has been allocated to upgrade emergency facilities at John Hunter Hospital.

Honourable members will recall the major problems at the emergency department at John Hunter Hospital, many of which have been highlighted by me and other members from the region over the past 12 months. I am pleased that funding is being provided to upgrade emergency facilities at John Hunter Hospital. In the Lake Macquarie electorate, some $800,000 has been allocated for upgrading Morisset Hospital. It is pleasing to see that the Government is honouring another commitment - that the facility will remain open - and that it is injecting funds into Morisset Hospital to ensure that the badly neglected facilities are upgraded. The Carr Government is committed to ensuring that health services in the Hunter region are restored following seven years of Liberal neglect. Health is one of Labor's priorities and the 1995-96 budget reflects that. As for the environment, recently legislation relating to environmental trusts was before the House. In the recent environmental trust allocations the State Government made two grants totalling $200,000 to the Lake Macquarie area. That is the maximum sum possible under the environmental trust grants scheme. [Extension of time agreed to.]

One grant was made to Lake Macquarie City Council for a tyre rehabilitation project. In the Wyee area in the southern part of the Lake Macquarie electorate, and in the southern part of Lake Macquarie City, some 250,000 illegally dumped tyres will be removed and the site rehabilitated. The objectives of the tyre project are, I hope, to reduce the risk of recurrence and to reduce the environmental hazard of burning tyres. Unfortunately only some three of four days after the announcement of the grant a fire started in the tyre dump. Many of the dumped tyres burnt and polluted the atmosphere. It took the local fire services some 24 hours to bring the blaze under control. We hope to remove those tyres and rehabilitate the area so that we can control any erosion and sedimentation problems and make it pleasant for community use.

A grant of $200,000 has been made to the North Lake Macquarie environmental management committee. The money will go towards the remediation of lead contaminated homes and playing fields in Boolaroo, Spears Point and Argenton. Most members would be aware of the lead contamination problems that exist in Lake Macquarie and of my efforts and those of my colleague the honourable member for Wallsend in trying to raise this issue in the House. We now have appropriate action from the Government. This grant is the first of many that will go towards multi-million dollar government-funded rehabilitation and remediation projects in the area. In particular, homes in which children with very high blood lead levels live will be targeted to try to reduce the blood lead levels of children to the National Health and Medical Research Council's goal of 10 micrograms per decilitre of blood. The Government has undertaken a major task that will proceed for a number of years. I am pleased that finally funds for such purposes are being provided.

A number of Ministers have agreed to meet with local State members from the Lake Macquarie region at an environmental forum on 30 November 1995. The forum will give local residents an opportunity to speak directly to Ministers, to their local members of Parliament and to authority representatives. At that forum the Minister for Land and Water Conservation, the Minister for Urban Affairs and Planning, the Minister for Fisheries and the Minister for the Environment will deliver the Government's response and plans for the rehabilitation and environmental restoration of the Lake Macquarie environment. Recently the Minister for Transport, in line with Labor's promise prior to the March election to improve rail services to Newcastle and Lake Macquarie, announced an increase in rail services on the Newcastle to Sydney
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line. On 22 October the new CityRail timetable was introduced. It shows an improvement in local train services. I shall detail to the House some of those improvements.

A new express service to Sydney will now depart at 8 a.m. It will stop at major stations such as Cardiff, Fassifern and Morisset, before proceeding non-stop to Sydney. For the first time a train departing from the Newcastle-Lake Macquarie area will not stop at Gosford or the central coast region. Newcastle and Lake Macquarie commuters will be taken directly to Sydney by an extremely quick express service. A new 3.25 p.m. service from Newcastle to the west Lake Macquarie area is operating, and the new early-morning train departing Newcastle at 2.47 a.m. will certainly cater for the youth of the west lakes and Hunter region area; people who patronise nightclubs and other venues in Newcastle city will have a safe means of returning home in the small hours of the morning. Many other services will now stop at the smaller stations of Dora Creek, Awaba, Booragul, Teralba and Cockle Creek. They will provide much-needed services to those small communities, which had their services drastically cut by the previous Government. I remember under the Greiner Government 35 services a day were slashed from these smaller stations. The Carr Labor Government is fulfilling its commitment to improve rail services.

On Monday the new Warabrook-University railway station on the Maitland line, costing $3 million, was opened. It will service Warabrook and the Newcastle University campus. It offers university students residing in the west lakes area a choice of either catching a bus to the university or using the State Rail system. With regard to health, housing, the environment, and roads and rail provision, the first Carr budget, which was delivered only a few weeks ago, is certainly delivering for the people of the Lake Macquarie electorate, and I commend it to the House.

Mr HARTCHER (Gosford) [11.35]: "We are all liars to those for whom we do not care", so said George Bernard Shaw and so said the Leader of the Opposition when he spoke about this first Carr Labor Government budget. There must be many people for whom the Labor Party and the Carr Government do not care because many people have not benefited from this budget. With regard to urban affairs, planning and housing, there has been a general decrease in allocation from $744 million of its total revenue flow to $715 million. The capital projection for the budget for urban affairs, planning and housing is $540 million of which $447 million is provided by the Federal Government and only approximately $130 million is provided by the State Government. The State's allocation to house the people of New South Wales, to plan for the capital works of the New South Wales Department of Planning is a mere $131.9 million.

Despite the fact that the amount of general revenue and capital works for the budget have been overwhelmingly downgraded the Government has taken the Federal allocation and put it into its own budget, claiming it as an achievement for New South Wales, and proposes to increase staff levels from 459 personnel to 493 personnel during the next financial year. All this from a government that pledged it would be lean, that it would cut mismanagement and waste and surplus positions in the public service. While the Minister for Urban Affairs and Planning sits in his new half million dollar office in the Governor Macquarie Tower he can look to the north and see the extent of the urban sprawl of the city of Sydney. He can see the Hawkesbury-Nepean river system, which is crying out for urgent attention - attention which this budget will not satisfy. He can look to the west and see the vast urban sprawl and the sadly neglected waterways in that direction. He can see for himself just how little he has done to check the urban sprawl and to ensure a better system for the waterways of Sydney.

What has the Minister for Housing done for the homeless and for those seeking new homes through the Department of Housing. During the election campaign Labor promised 3,100 units in its first year of government. Just what was that figure based upon? It was based upon a pre-existing projected figure of the Department of Housing. When the Government introduced its housing policy in March 1995 it said, "We will build 3,100 units" - the very number that the Department of Housing had planned to build in the following year. In other words, a vote for Labor means not additional public additional housing units, only those already planned for. The forward capital works figures are extremely interesting. Only 3,032 new units are referred to in the estimates, not 3,100 as promised would be delivered in the 1995-96 financial year.

The Government cannot deliver on its own projected figure for the ensuing year. In the Government's forward capital works for the development of new housing units for Sydney's homeless there is reference to 2,061 units that were commenced during the period in office of the Fahey Government. They have not been completed; they have been carried over. That simply means that this Government has slowed down spending and is spreading the establishment of these units over a longer period. It does not take two years to build a small residential block of half a dozen units. The capital figures in the forward estimates indicate that these days most Department of Housing structures are in single blocks of 10, 12 or 15 units, yet the construction of 2,061 of these units is being spread over a two-year period. The Government is decreasing the amount of money it is making available to provide housing for the homeless in this State simply to make its budget figures look that much better.

In this State 88,000 people are on Department of Housing waiting lists, and that figure is growing at an average rate of 12,000 people a year. Taking account of the 3,100 so-called new units - which are simply a carry forward of new units projected by
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the Fahey Government - and the 2,061 non-completed units, the Government is simply ensuring that the waiting lists continue to grow exponentially in future years. I now refer to land development programs that provide new releases through Landcom. Under the Fahey Government the acquisition budget for Landcom was $30.4 million, this year under a Labor government the allocation has fallen to $22.5 million - an effective cut of almost 40 per cent. The budget for development works has been cut from $149.8 million to $105.5 million - once again, a 40 per cent reduction in funds to acquire land or to develop existing land.

About 13,500 hectares of land is held by the Government - the largest stock held by any body in New South Wales. This Government has effectively reduced funding for the development of that land from $150 million to $105 million - a cut of 40 per cent - yet it is claiming that it is trying to do something for the homeless of this State. The Government claims that it wants to look after people and give them homes, but where are the funds being diverted to? Only last month the Minister announced that Landcom was going to sell off those 13,500 hectares of land. The Minister said that Landcom was not going to develop the land; that it would refocus on developing homes within inner-city areas and on developing dilapidated and disused former industrial sites.

Its first action was the purchase of a block of eight brand new home units in Russell Lea, which is located next to Drummoyne on Sydney's waterfront. Some time ago those units were for sale at $375,000 each. Is that an example of effective management of public funds? Will this action ensure that the homeless are housed? The Government is buying units that have three bedrooms, spa baths, gourmet kitchens and water views at an advertised price of $375,000 each. For the same money that the Government has wasted purchasing eight luxurious home unites it could have provided ordinary housing for about 25 families. That is an example of how the Minister and his department are spending their sadly reduced financial allocation.

I now wish to deal with issues relating to Sydney's waterways. The Government promised that it would legislate for the 20-year $7 billion clean waters program. I await with interest a response from the Minister to a question I place on notice about the program. However, not a single dollar of the promised $7 billion is shown in the budget papers. Where is it? More significantly, the Government claims, "We have saved $30 million a year by rescheduling sewerage works." Urgently needed sewerage works to cope with Sydney's dying waterways and the enormous difficulties we are facing cleaning up our rivers, creeks, estuaries and harbours - all of them heavily polluted by stormwater or sewerage - are now being rescheduled. The Government is claiming as an achievement the fact that it is saving $30 million a year.

New capital works for Sydney Water for 1995-96 total $50 million in a program which this Government concedes will cost $7 billion. At that rate it will take 140 years for the $7 billion program to achieve its target. The previous Government proposed to raise the wall of Warragamba Dam by approximately 23 metres to protect the flood plain area below it, upon which 52,000 homes have been constructed accommodating 250,000 people. The Minister for Consumer Affairs, who represents people in that area, shows scant regard for their welfare and has not taken into account the threat of a major flood along the lines as that experienced in 1864. If there were ever a repeat of such a flood, no system would be in place to protect people on the flood plain below.

Instead of increasing the height of the dam wall the Government proposes to provide a spillway at a cost of $90 million. The previous Government had earmarked $180 million to raise the wall of the dam. But how much of the projected $90 million has the Government allocated in this budget for what it says will be a solution to the problems of the people in the Minister's electorate? It has allocated a total of $2 million. I suppose the Minister was not even aware of that. I am sure she did not check the budget papers to establish what her area and her people were going to get. An amount of $2 million out of a $90 million program will be ineffective; it will achieve very little. At that rate the $90 million Warragamba Dam program will take 45 years to complete. The budget papers state that the program will be completed in the year 2000, yet there are no forward estimates to suggest how the money is to be allocated in future years. Over the 1995-96 period only $2 million will be spent.

The Government promised to clean up Sydney's beaches, yet there has been no allocation to clean up beaches south of Sydney, in the Cronulla area. Potters Point urgently needs sewerage upgrading - a commitment given in the water protection program issued by the Australian Labor Party in March 1995, pledged by the Labor candidate for Sutherland at the election, and promised by the present Premier when he visited that area to campaign. Where is that allocation in the budget papers? It has fallen off the map. Not a single dollar has been allocated for the Potters Point program, despite the Government's commitment and its promises. The children of Cronulla, North Cronulla and Wanda beaches will continue to swim in sewage because this Government has reneged on its promise to build the Potters Point sewage treatment works, to upgrade sewage treatment and to ensure that the beaches to the south of Sydney are made clean.

The Carr Labor Government claims that it is a government that looks after the battlers of this State. In the past a fund was established to assist battlers; it was called the water and sewerage assistance scheme for pensioners. Funding for that scheme has been cut in this budget. In the previous year
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$76 million was allocated to the fund; this budget has allocated $72 million. Allowing for 4 per cent inflation, that represents a cut in real terms of approximately $6 million to $8 million. This is s scheme for the battlers - the people that the Australian Labor Party claims to represent and protect. The budget does not mention urban sprawl. Regularly we hear the pious statements of the Minister for Urban Affairs and Planning about his instructions to councils to curb urban sprawl, but not a single dollar has been allocated to planning, computer modelling or for assistance to control excessive urban development in metropolitan Sydney.

The Government claims it wants to develop a solution to the urban sprawl, which has affected the great metropolis of Sydney. One of the major social crises of Sydney is the plight of single, homeless women. Not a single dollar has been allocated to enhance programs for homeless women. Numerous reports show that their number is increasing and support for them is chronically underserviced. Many homeless women are victims of violence; others are victims of ill health; some are mentally ill. Despite the plethora of reports that pour across the Minister's desk about the plight of single homeless women in Sydney - formerly known as bag women - nothing has been allocated to address the problem. The Government should be condemned for its indifference to the fate of these people. With regard to crisis unit accommodation, which is housing for those desperately needing accommodation because of personal or marital crises, the Fahey Government built 136 new units for such people. How many units are planned under the Carr Government? A total of only 42. [Extension of time agreed to.]

How many new accommodation units are planned for the mentally ill in this State? The Richmond report, which was implemented by the Wran Government, displaced and cast on to the streets many people suffering mental illnesses. The Burdekin report identified the tragic circumstances of these people. It recommended that the State Government receive $15 million in funds from the Federal Government over a four-year period to provide housing for the mentally ill. What will New South Wales receive from that $15 million for the thousands of mentally ill people in New South Wales? A total of 34 new units for crisis accommodation! The budget has allowed for the planning of 42 units for crisis accommodation, yet thousands of people are subjected to homelessness and crises every year. Does the Government care about these people? Does the Government have any plans for the future of those who are sorely in need of assistance?

The budget also reveals that the Government has made an allowance for coastal land acquisition. This Government issued many statements about coastal land acquisition. The Minister has made himself out to be some latter day hero trying to stop projects that were already on the drawing boards. What land does the Government plan to acquire along the hundreds of miles of New South Wales coast to protect those areas from development? The total budget this year for land acquisition is $1.6 million compared to the $5 million and $7 million spent on coastal land acquisition by the Minister's predecessor, the Hon. Robert Webster, last year and the year before. At most, $1.6 million will purchase a single coastal property in the 1995-96 year. This Government is not serious about protecting the coast and it is not serious about acquiring land. It says it is serious about stopping other people engaging in commercial activities, but that is always easily done by ministerial fiat. The Government is not serious about its expenditure and commitment.

Prior to the election the Minister and the Premier made great play about the Dunbogan canal development. An inquiry into that development is still proceeding, yet the Premier said that it would not be allowed to proceed. If the Premier is serious that the proposal will not proceed, why were sessions of inquiry held as recently as October? No funds have been allocated for South Sydney City Council despite the enormous financial burden it will face as a consequence of the decisions of this Government about the Sydney showground. The budget offers no financial assistance or planning for the showground development and no funds have been allocated to overcome the problems that will arise for residents of the area.

I shall now address the Carr Government's budget and its impact on the people of the central coast. Prior to the State election the people of the central coast were subjected to a 32-page document called, "Labor's infrastructure plan for the central coast", which contains pages of promises to the people of the region. Over the next four years much will be heard about that. I shall now deal with some particular aspects of that document. A new police station at Kincumber was promised for Christmas 1995. What appears in the budget? The police station has been deferred to 1998. The cost of the new police station is $2.2 million, but only $305,000 is allocated. A promise for Christmas 1995 has disappeared into the cloudy nether world of 1998.

A promise was made that Avoca Drive, a major arterial road in the Gosford electorate, would be completed in the four-year term of this Government. The estimated cost of roadworks for that 14 kilometre road is approximately $18 million. How much has been allocated for that program? An amount of $2 million has been allocated to complete the existing works. Once again a commitment by this Government for the completion of a program over its four-year term has disappeared off the face of the map. We were told that Labor would ensure jobs were available for people of the central coast, a specific commitment that I am sure the honourable member for Peats would prefer to forget. One program that would bring jobs in abundance to the people of the central coast is the International
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Garden Festival. The honourable member for Peats shakes her head at the mention of that program, and that demonstrates her commitment to the 900 jobs the festival would bring to the central coast.

Mr Iemma: You just plucked that figure out of the air.

Mr HARTCHER: That figure is not mine; it was costed by independent consultants and supported by Barry Cohen, the good member of the Australian Labor Party. The tourism budget contains nothing for the International Garden Festival. Not a single allocation has been made for that festival, and the 900 jobs that it was hoped would be available to the people of the central coast have also disappeared. The central coast is an area as large as metropolitan Sydney. It has major arterial roads, very few footpaths and quite a difficult topographical layout yet, as a result of cuts to the school bus subsidy system, hundreds - if not thousands - of school children who live a considerable distance from their schools will be forced to walk through difficult areas without footpaths, and often without street lighting. I venture to suggest that the majority of school children will be affected by this proposal because very few would live within the 2.1 kilometre radius. This House has heard nothing from other honourable members who represent central coast seats. But the people and the children of the central coast will be one of the most disadvantaged groups because of a decision of the State Government. Nevertheless, the budget papers show this proposal as a saving.

The State Government claims that a saving will be achieved by cutting the school bus subsidy, by endangering the lives of school children, by exposing them to walking long distances and over difficult terrain to get to their schools - a saving at the cost of our children. People on the central coast were promised a 24-hour medical service at Long Jetty hospital, but there is no funding for a 24-hour medical service at Long Jetty hospital in the Carr budget. That was a commitment given in March. They were promised an allocation of $200,000 for stage three development of Wyong hospital. The budget papers list a number of hospitals, but Wyong hospital is not one of them. Like Long Jetty hospital, Wyong hospital has slipped off the list. The rebuilding of Gosford railway station and the installation of escalators was yet another promise, but when one looks at the capital works program for State Rail in the budget papers, one finds that Gosford railway station rates scant mention so far as track security, but not a single cent has been allocated to the escalator program promised in March.

The central coast was promised that there would be more jobs. The one program canned by this Government, the get started program for young unemployed, was a major jobs generator for the people of the central coast, for the hundreds of unemployed youth each year who were getting a chance at dignity, employment and a new life. This Government has turned its back on them and said that there will be no job creation program; no get started program; the young unemployed of the central coast can be flung on the refuse heap. This Government claims to care for the people of the central coast who are represented by the honourable member for Wyong and the honourable member for Peats, but those honourable members have not publicly raised their voices to defend the get started program; they have not raised their voices to condemn the failure to fund Wyong hospital or the failure to fund Long Jetty hospital.

Rail commuters of the central coast were promised that they would benefit from the Hornsby to Parramatta line, that they could travel on the Newcastle line to Hornsby then go straight to Parramatta without having to go via Strathfield. That $400 million commitment was made by the Premier and the Minister for Transport. Once again, it has simply dropped out of the budget papers - not a mention of it! That was a major commitment not only to the people of Sydney and Newcastle, but to the people of the central coast who have been disadvantaged by this budget. That commitment was a con trick played upon the people of the central coast, and the budget papers reveal it to be a con trick. For example, in the budget papers the 1995-96 capital works allocation for Tumbi Umbi high school, which the honourable member for The Entrance praised in his budget speech, is $51,000. It is a $4 million program.

The Government is carrying over $3.8 million from the 1994-95 year and claiming it is spending $4 million. The amount the Labor Party is spending on Tumbi Umbi high school is $51,000. The rest of the money is a carry over from a previous commitment of the Fahey Government. Similar examples are found throughout these budget papers. It is a budget built upon lies. It is a budget given by a Premier who is discredited, by a Premier who has broken his word, by a Premier who cannot be trusted, and it is serviced by a ministry who similarly are people without honour, people who made commitments over and over again in March and the preceding months, yet who are not prepared to honour them. This is a budget of lies and deceit, and as the Leader of the Opposition so correctly said when he spoke in reply to the budget speech, "We are all liars to people for whom we do not care." The Australian Labor Party and the Carr Government do not care. [Time expired.]

Mr THOMPSON (Rockdale) [12.05]: I am very proud to be part of this Government which, in its very first budget, in extremely tight fiscal circumstances and given the inheritance from its predecessor, has allocated a 20 per cent increase in funding for community services, aged services and disability services. Over the last seven years the people of New South Wales have put up with deficiencies in these vital areas of child protection and child care. Under the Carr Labor Government, in its very first budget, children's services, especially those to protect children, are once again
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embraced as a core government responsibility. I applaud the initiatives contained in the budget for the less well off in our community. The budget covering community services, aged services and disability services exceeds $1 billion - a massive 20 per cent increase on the amount spent last financial year.

Some of the features of this most welcome budget allocation include a $50 million increase for housing and care programs for people with disabilities, an additional 60 specialist child protection workers, an extra $7.5 million over the next three years for community services grants programs, an additional 13,000 child-care places over the next three years, and real growth funding for the home and community care program of $14 million over three years. The Carr Labor Government has a long-term, comprehensive strategy, with funding to match, to redress seven years of Liberal-National Party neglect. Many people in my electorate, and I am sure in other electorates, are not particularly well-off; they live in difficult financial and social circumstances, or they have difficulty coping with disabilities. I am proud to be able to proclaim that this Government is committed to ensuring that such people have the same rights and access as all other people to quality of life, community-based support, retirement and education. In that respect I quote a couple of paragraphs from a letter to the Editor of the Sydney Morning Herald of 16 October written by the Revd Gordon Moyes, Superintendent of the Wesley Mission who wrote:

Michael Egan should be proud of many parts of his first State Budget. His Government's allocations aimed at tackling major social justice issues, such as child abuse and support services for those with disabilities, are substantial and welcome.

The elderly and the disabled also emerge as big winners, with nearly $300 million being devoted to various services catering for their specific needs and lifestyles. As they are two demographic groups which have limited political clout, this, too, is a welcome approach.

No doubt other aspects of the Government's financial strategies will be criticised.

We have heard enough criticism today. The letter continued:

However, as a fiscally responsible organisation also doing its bit to redress the imbalances that exist in our society, Wesley Mission applauds the thrust of this week's budget.

For Mr Egan, it has been 30 years worth the wait.

I say amen to that. One of the areas of great concern in my electorate is public housing. It is therefore gratifying to note that this budget has significantly increased funding for housing. Overall this budget means a better deal for public housing throughout New South Wales. Funding for capital works has been increased by nearly $35 million, from $503.6 million to $538.3 million. This is good news for existing tenants in the Rockdale electorate, and improves the prospects of people on the waiting lists. Hardly a day goes by in my electorate office when we do not witness the near heartbreak of people who have to be told it will be seven to eight years before they will be housed. That is the cruel legacy of the previous Government's policy on public housing. After seven long years of Liberal-National Party Government the waiting list for public housing has grown and grown.

Through this budget, increased funding has also been directed to community housing projects, which will see community housing organisations working with the Government to provide greater housing choice. A range of creative and targeted programs will address the housing needs of special community groups. Most importantly for older settled areas such as Rockdale, funding for maintenance has also been boosted to enable more effective upkeep of properties. The Carr Labor Government, through its very first budget, has stamped its priorities right across the key areas and is delivering on core services such as housing. Another concern of the people in my electorate is the broad issue of law and order, and in particular policing of our local district. The Rockdale area mainly falls within the jurisdiction of the Kogarah police patrol. Rockdale police station has been the subject of previous representations from me, particularly as the previous Government allowed it to run down to the disgraceful state it is in now.

Over the last few years Rockdale police station has lost its status as a fully-fledged station. Its staff were moved to Kogarah, but while beat police were stationed at Rockdale, the station had no official status. There is no doubt that conditions at Rockdale police station were not up to standard. In the past I have described those conditions as positively dickensian - the station was far too small and the police had to work in cramped and unpleasant surroundings. Instead of spending relatively few dollars to bring Rockdale police station up to scratch, the previous Government allowed it to run down and then moved the staff to Kogarah. The state of Kogarah police station is also of concern to my constituents. Rockdale is within the Kogarah police district. So we had the situation where 40-odd police were moved from the Rockdale station to an already overcrowded Kogarah police station. I note from the budget papers that the Carr Labor Government has recognised the problem and that a new police station is to be built at Kogarah.

New police facilities are many years overdue, and I applaud the Government's action in going ahead with this project. Better facilities and better working conditions for our police are well and truly overdue. The budget priorities of the Carr Labor Government stand in stark contrast to the record of the previous Government, particularly in relation to policing facilities in Rockdale and Kogarah. In 1991 police Minister Pickering declined to spend a modest sum on improvements to Rockdale police station to allow it to continue as a real police station. At the same time he was spending an estimated $1.5 million to establish his personal
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office, with all the trappings, in police headquarters. It was clear that the real motive behind the downgrading of Rockdale police station was financial - this at a time when police Minister Pickering was luxuriously fitting out the twentieth floor of police headquarters for his own comfort and his considerable ego.

Rockdale police station was downgraded from a fully operational patrol to shopfront status. While the Kogarah patrol is to get a new police station, Rockdale is also to be recognised through the current budget process. I was pleased to note that improvements are to be made - the preliminary estimated cost is $100,000. I have been informed by the Minister for Police that Rockdale police station will be prioritised in an effort to overcome the years of neglect. It is timely for the upgrade to be done. Early this year Rockdale achieved city status and Rockdale City Council is keen to see the station rehabilitated to a standard in keeping with this new status.

The Rockdale electorate is an outstanding example of the success of Australia's multiculturalism. About 40 per cent of families within the electorate do not speak English at home. There is great cultural diversity in our area and it is a credit to Australian society that people from varied backgrounds get on so well. It is mainly because of the ethnic nature of much of my electorate that I read with great interest the social justice budget statement. Ethnic communities, like the broader Australian community, have great reliance on a fair, equitable and acceptable health system, good policing, education and training, services for the young, the aged and the disabled, decent and affordable housing, safe and reliable public transport, and so on.

It is a core responsibility of Government to ensure that government programs and services are appropriate and accessible to people from non-English speaking backgrounds. It is important that all government agencies continue to be required to submit an ethnic affairs policy statement each year, detailing management strategies and policies undertaken to ensure that programs and services are appropriate and accessible. Through this budget, government advertising and information will better reflect the cultural diversity of the population. A proportion of this expenditure, set at 7.5 per cent, will be allocated specifically to ethnic media for the provision of community information. It may not be readily appreciated by many members, but it is most important that government agencies or departments, when giving out information, allocate a reasonable amount for advertising in the ethnic press. Often, with the best will in the world, the message does not get through to major sections of our community unless that is done. I applaud the Government's action in specifying that 7.5 per cent of advertising expenditure will be made in that area.

Many people from non-English speaking backgrounds find it difficult to access and use basic services and to understand their rights and responsibilities under the legal system, due to language and cultural differences. The 24-hour emergency interpreter translation service to the Ethnic Affairs Commission, the Department of Health and the Police Service will be improved. The service will also be extended, by the expenditure of $600,000 per annum, to other agencies including the Attorney General's Department, the Department of Corrective Services and the Department of Juvenile Justice. Language services will also be extended to rural New South Wales - action that is well overdue. Where needs for translation and interpreter services have been identified, integrated networks of interpreters will be established. There is nothing more fundamental for people in our community than to be able to communicate with each other and with the authorities, especially on matters of policing and health. I applaud the measures in the budget.

The Ethnic Affairs Commission Act is being reviewed for the first time in 18 years, and the commission is being reviewed to ensure that it plays a crucial role in coordinating and delivering services to ethnic communities. The Government is to provide $1.5 million in community grants through the Ethnic Affairs Commission in 1995-96. Education is a key to improving life opportunities for people in New South Wales, including those from non-English speaking backgrounds. The teaching of community languages is an important element in continuing cultural traditions and preparing children for working life in a multicultural society. As part of the multicultural education plan, the first 42 of 96 extra community language teachers, costing $8.7 million over three years, will be recruited in 1995-96, with the remainder to be recruited over the following three years. That provision will have an effect in the Rockdale electorate because so many people are involved in the teaching of community languages and making efforts to maintain cultural traditions so that people can retain some of the good things of their heritage and at the same time blend into society and live good, productive lives in Australia.

Traffic is probably the major issue for most people in my electorate; it is a scourge. The volume of traffic in many suburbs in the Rockdale electorate is often unbelievable. Brighton, Rockdale, Bexley, Arncliffe, Bexley North and Kingsgrove suffer tremendously because of the stream of cars and trucks that use the local roads. I have spoken on this issue on many occasions. I am pleased that the M5 roadworks are finally to go ahead. I was one of the loudest critics of the road as proposed by the previous Government. Leading up to the 25 March election the spotlight in my electorate was focused strongly on the M5 east motorway, particularly the proposed extension from Beverly Hills to Kyeemagh.

As I have said on many occasions in this House, local consensus was in favour of the construction of the M5, but the community was also concerned about the Roads and Traffic Authority and the then Government's preferred option which,
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if it had been implemented, would have caused considerable harm to the local environment. It would have devastated the suburbs of Turrella and Arncliffe and ruined the lives of many families who reside in the area. The worst-case scenario was that the residential and industrial areas would have been cut in half. As I said at the time, it would have been an outrageous and unconscionable disregard for the whole community for the road construction to go ahead as it was then planned.

If it had gone ahead, apart from causing social stress it would have detracted from the economic viability of the proposed north Arncliffe railway station, which the Government hopes will be built on the new southern railway line connecting Sydney (Kingsford-Smith) Airport and the city. Imagine our delight when the Carr Labor Government demonstrated that it was listening to the people. No longer is the preferred option a road that would destroy a whole community. The new preferred option, as announced by the Minister, is people friendly and environmentally friendly - or as friendly as a road can be. In response to the exhibited environmental impact statement, 524 submissions and 1,675 formal letters were received. Many of the submissions raised concerns about the visual impact of the elevated motorway in Turrella and the impact on residents in Arncliffe. Some suggestions for new alignments were received. A new, more direct tunnel is now being considered. The impact of the proposal is currently being developed and assessed. [Extension of time agreed to.]

Because of the longer tunnel in the new proposal, two air ventilation stacks will be required. That could be a problem for local people because nobody wants a ventilation stack next to their house or in their local park. A lot of work is being done to identify viable alternatives for locating those ventilation stacks. The community is involved in that process and all are vitally concerned that a satisfactory solution is found. There is a significant wetland area where the road comes out of the tunnel east of Marsh Street, Arncliffe. Local consultation is taking place between the Roads and Traffic Authority and local people as to the best way to ensure that the wetland area is not interfered with by the roadworks.

In a perfect world there would be no need for motorways such as the M5, because previous generations would have properly planned for the expansion of places like Sydney (Kingsford-Smith) Airport; for the massive growth of Port Botany; for the tremendous increase in container trucks and trucks carrying industrial goods, inflammable liquids and so on; and the massive growth in commuter traffic. There has been considerable expansion in petrochemical works in the Botany area. The Kurnell oil refinery is on the other side of the bay, and possibly 90 per cent of trucks travelling to places around the rim of the bay travel through the Rockdale electorate. The main roads become clogged, forcing traffic into residential streets as drivers look for short cuts. There is chaos and utter confusion. Regrettably, I know of no realistic alternative to the M5. We do not live in a perfect world. The State Labor Government will ensure that the road will be built in a manner that is sympathetic to the people of my electorate.

Railways are another major issue for people in my electorate, particularly the aspect of rail safety. This issue has received a major boost in the budget. Rail security has been given a monetary increase in the budget, and hopefully it will help restore public confidence in rail travel through the implementation of measures to improve passenger safety and security. An additional $1.5 million a year for more rail staff, and a further $500,000 for more late-night train services are among items in the October budget to improve services for CityRail commuters. Central to passenger safety is the safe station program, a network of more than 60 stations with security and safety features such as staffing until the last train. Rockdale station is not on the list of those stations. I have raised the matter with the Minister for Transport, as Rockdale is a major centre for transport. About 10 or 12 buses terminate at or operate from Rockdale, bringing passengers from all parts of Sydney to the railway station. It is a major centre for commuters and it is worthy of being included in the list of railway stations needing work.

Since taking office the Carr Labor Government has increased transit police numbers. Uniformed, unarmed security guards have been employed to patrol trains and stations. A comprehensive $2.25 million safety upgrade has begun at Cabramatta railway station, the first in the promised safe station programs. Cabramatta certainly needs attention in that regard. Work is expected to commence before the end of the year and to be completed by the end of next year. The Government has also created the Transport Safety Bureau, a specialist body to improve safety and security on public transport. The Government has also extended the two-carriage Nightsafe service. There will be an extra 42 services on week nights and an extra 44 extra services at weekends. Those services will begin an hour earlier than has been the case, that is, at 7 p.m. coming into the city and at 8 p.m. leaving the city. These are important issues for people who live in the suburbs in my electorate. The Government has also completed a safety audit of 169 suburban railway stations, and we should see something come out of that in the near future. It has also extended closed-circuit television surveillance to a further 33 stations, with more scheduled for early next year.

I again applaud the Carr Government for the tremendous job that it has done in its first budget. When one looks at the legacy of seven long years of Liberal-National Government, one sees that credit must go to the Carr Labor Government for responding with a budget that is as worthy as the one that has been delivered. I shall quote a few
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people who have made statements about the budget. In the Sydney Morning Herald of 11 October Glenda Korporaal said:

What Mr Carr is doing is delivering on his election promises - such as slashing hospital waiting lists . . .

In the Daily Telegraph Mirror on the same day Terry McCrann said:

Bob Carr and Michael Egan have given us a middle-of-the-road Budget we can happily live with.

No pain, some gain - and even some fiscal prudence for the future of our children and grandchildren.

In the Australian on 11 October Alan Wood said:

For a new Labor Government with a majority of one . . . NSW Treasurer Michael Egan's first Budget is a respectable start.

The Labor Council of New South Wales, in a press release on 10 October - I put great stock in the Labor Council - described the budget as:

A "fair dinkum Labor Budget" that "lays out plans for more jobs for teachers, nurses, police and welfare workers . . ."

To cap them off, I quote what the Deputy Leader of the Opposition said on the 7.30 Report on 10 October:

The best part of the budget is the . . . extra staff in health, extra staff in police, education . . . that is to be commended.

I wholeheartedly concur.

Mr CHAPPELL (Northern Tablelands) [12.33]: The only way to describe the 1995-96 State budget, the first budget of the Carr Labor Government, is as a sell-out of country New South Wales. I have spoken with most honourable members who represent country electorates and they all say that country electorates have suffered cutbacks, cancellations and deferrals of projects, and closures of government services. In summary, this constitutes a sell-out of the long-term interests of the people whom we represent in this Parliament. My electorate of Northern Tablelands is a notable example of that. We have suffered much the same as other electorates around the State have suffered. Expenditure on health, roads, housing, education and sports has been cut in one form or another. Projects have been deferred, and projects that were expected to go ahead or that the previous Government promised would go ahead have simply not figured in the budget.

In recent years budget nights have been reasonably long nights for me, phoning councils and interested groups to advise them of new capital works projects or projects throughout my electorate that have received funding. This year that process did not take too long. It was a fairly short affair as far as identifying capital works projects because there were few such projects. The budget papers are less specific and less comprehensive this year than they were in the past. It did not take me long to conclude that my electorate and the electorates of most of my country colleagues have not fared well in the budget. I was able to tell my community that the projects that would continue to be funded were those that commenced under the previous Government or those to which the previous Government had made a commitment. Half-built schools and other projects that are under way will continue. I suppose that if being grateful for small mercies counts in this place, I am grateful that those projects will proceed to completion.

This year it was more difficult to find information in the budget papers. There had been a continuous and consistent improvement each year in the presentation of the budget papers and supporting information. This year the Government has taken a step backwards with regard to the details. Many projects have been lumped together under the rather innocuous heading of "various". It is not possible for local members to identify specific projects that have been funded or to identify when continuing funding has been guaranteed. As I said, there was much less for us to find, particularly in non-Government seats and country seats. The major disappointments for the Northern Tablelands electorate are highlighted in the health budget. Armidale and New England Hospital is long overdue for a major update. Indeed, that has been a contentious issue over the past year or two.

The former Minister for Health promised that the update would definitely be on the drawing board for this year. Indeed, much preliminary work had been done - and expressions of interest had been received from the private sector - on building part of the hospital as a private ward in a range of different possible combinations. That work was well under way, and we expected a serious movement forward by way of an allocation of funding for that project this year. As my colleague the shadow minister for health said earlier today, during a visit to Armidale in December last year the current Minister for Health said that the Armidale and New England Hospital was the second worst-resourced hospital in the State. The Minister, together with the ALP candidate and the ALP party faithful, clearly told the community that the project would have priority, and that if a Labor Government were elected we would see some action on the project this year. We have not seen any action yet and we have had no indication of when there will be further movements forward.

I took a punt last year that I should press the Government to proceed with construction of the new emergency unit at the Armidale and New England Hospital in advance of the major redevelopment. If I had not done that, I am sure that we would not even have a commitment of funds for that emergency unit, as we have this year. I took a risk that paid off in the sense that at least we got second prize, even if we did not get first prize with regard to redevelopment at Armidale and New England Hospital. An emergency unit at Inverell District Hospital is overdue. Inverell District Hospital is a good hospital in every respect except for its
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emergency unit, which is appalling. We expected to see an allocation of funding for that project and significant movement in the planning of and commitment to it. However, no money has been allocated, which is disappointing to me as local member and to those who use the hospital.

Prince Albert Memorial Hospital in Tenterfield received a minor allocation of some $200,000, which I suppose will get initial planning under way for what will eventually be a $1.8 million multipurpose facility at the hospital. Once again we are grateful for small mercies; hopefully, $200,000 will at least lock in that project for the next financial year. It will be interesting to see whether the party apologists who made so much of the health funding situation in Armidale and, indeed, throughout the electorate during the lead-up to the election will be as vocal and as critical of the failure of the Government to honour hospital expenditure and health expenditure generally throughout the electorate. Let us see whether they continue to attack the Government for failing to act on its promises. We will continue to apply pressure on behalf of the community at Armidale for that major redevelopment. I will continue to beat a path to the Minister's door as I continue to press for the redevelopment. It is well overdue and it is something to which my community is well and truly entitled. I will continue working tirelessly to see that my community gets it.

I took some delight from a press release of the Minister for Health that stated there had been an enhancement of $4.5 million of revenue to our health budget in the New England region. That is a significant amount and I thought it might close the gap and bring funding closer to the level it should be. However, on closer examination it seems that $1.4 million of that amount is not revenue but capital that will go towards the accident and emergency unit at the Armidale Hospital to which I previously referred. An amount of $200,000 is earmarked for Tenterfield, and I referred to that earlier. The $4.5 million includes money from the Commonwealth Government to fund the Commonwealth dental scheme in the region. It includes also annual consumer price index escalations for goods and services, and repairs and maintenance. In fact, there is no enhancement at all in the amount of general revenue.

Hospital directors in my electorate are concerned that this year they will have greater difficulty than ever before in providing those services that are traditionally delivered through the hospitals. Far from the budget allocation of $4.5 million being an improvement and an enhancement, it is a step backwards. The provision of services is made more difficult by the imposition of silly pressures, such as those that apply to hospital waiting lists. We all want the waiting lists to be reduced and, in fact, in the last 12 months those lists were reduced dramatically in my electorate by better management of the waiting lists program. The undue pressure being put on the reduction of waiting lists, for purely political purposes, is causing disruptions to the delivery of services and the resulting problems are not helped by the fact that no additional revenue is available for the delivery of health services. This situation is a major disappointment to us.

So far as road funding is concerned, one could reasonably expect that every country member would argue that country roads need additional funding, and they do. The 3 x 3 program that was developed by the former Government has been singularly successful. Having produced major advances in roads infrastructure, the construction of bridges and so forth, that program has now been emasculated. All country people are extremely disappointed and angry with this Government for selling out on that program, especially as it held the promise of further significant gains for country road construction.

The construction of Burying Ground Creek Bridge is many years overdue. Now $800,000 has been allocated for its construction. That will provide a good start on new bridge works and associated roadworks, but it will have to be completed in the next financial year's budget. But that is the only significant project in my electorate this year, yet it is an electorate of many thousands of kilometres of roads. Urgent additional funding should be given to a number of roads in my electorate, for example, work on Main Road 135 from Inverell through to Ebor, Main Road 74, the Mount Lindsay main road north of Tenterfield, and the road through Uralla Shire that runs all the way from Bundarra to Walcha. The prospect is that there will be less funding as more and more of the 3 x 3 roads funding is diverted to non-roadworks, principally in the metropolitan area.

Cutbacks to funding for hospitals and roads, together with associated cutbacks in staffing and contracting projects that flow from that, will have an impact on the skill base of country towns to continue to provide services and to build infrastructure. Another cutback in my electorate is that of the night rail service. It took a lot of fight to get the Xplorer country rail service redeveloped and it has been amazingly successful. Patronage on weekend rail services on Friday nights and Sunday nights was increasing. That service was of great significance in the Armidale area, particularly to the large number of university students who come from the metropolitan area and who want to be able to get back to Sydney for an occasional weekend. They will no longer be able to do that by using the night Xplorer.

School education is important in all electorates but probably more so in mine because of the presence there of the University of New England and other educational institutions. Fortunately major projects have continued, or in some cases been concluded, at Inverell public school, at Ross Hill public school also in Inverell, and at Ben Venue public school in Armidale. All I can say is
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thank goodness those projects were well under way under the previous Government. The allocation of funds in this year's budget brings the remainder of those projects to conclusion. Thank goodness the previous Government had committed expenditure to those projects. Were that not the case I am sure this Government would not have allocated funding for them.

My major concern relates to continuing cutbacks in other services, for example, in the education sector. For example, I refer to the closure of the regional office of the Department of School Education for the north and north-west region. That office gave excellent service. It dealt with matters such as services to and professional support for teachers and students, curriculum matters, building and related infrastructure matters, and support to cluster directors. Those services have been withdrawn, so that there is now a gross loss of facility and service to educators throughout the region. We have been told that no jobs would be lost, but that is not the case. I can quote one very sad example. It is an absolute disgrace on the part of this Government and on the part of the Government of which I was a member that an administrator has been on the staff as a casual employee for 23 years. That person had been on the State payroll for 23 years working for the Department of School Education and was not eligible to apply for one of the few permanent positions that remain in that district. It is a very great shame that this person has been cast aside by this Government and the matter saddens me.

In the last couple of days I heard that the coordinator and the clerical assistant for the New England Educational Diagnostic Centre have been told that their jobs will finish at the end of the year. That centre is a major part of the education infrastructure in the north and north-west of New South Wales. It helps disadvantaged school children, especially those with learning difficulties and those who experience great difficulties settling into school in the first instance. This centre was the first of a series of special education services in country New South Wales. Although it started as a community project in conjunction with the university, some years ago it came within the department's funding program. Now it is being dumped. This vital part of the educational service of the north and north-west will be scrapped, thrown aside, and the kids will lose the benefit of that vital service. I will say more about this matter on a later occasion in this place.

I know staff cuts of one type or another are occurring across the State. This morning I heard of the withdrawal of the vocational guidance officer position from the Department of Industrial Relations in Armidale. Although it is not a terribly high profile position in that department, it underpins the delivery of services by the Government to the people of my electorate, yet it is now withdrawn. What will happen to the rest of the staff of that office? When will we hear of further cutbacks or, indeed, of the closure of that office? This pattern of staff reductions is going on throughout country New South Wales. It makes a mockery of claims about the role of the Department of Regional Development. It makes a mockery of the proclamation of next year as the year of regional development in New South Wales, but I will say a bit more about that later.

A major disappointment to me is the cutback in funding to the capital assistance program of the Department of Sport and Recreation. Over recent years I and my colleagues have come to expect somewhere of the order of $40,000 a year to come into our electorates for project support. That funding has been of great importance to many communities and sporting organisations, large and small. This year we will probably see, plus or minus, an allocation of $20,000. The result of that decreased funding is that many projects simply will not happen. I wonder if the Minister realises what a major benefit that funding is to very small country communities. Often they are just names on a map but, in fact, many of those communities are the focus of attention for families that gather around a tennis court or a sporting reserve for a fortnightly or monthly get-together. Those worthwhile community projects in my electorate will no longer receive the sort of support I was able to direct to them over the last several years.

When I drive from Inverell to Glen Innes late of an afternoon I usually see a group of people playing tennis with their kids. There is no visible sign of a settlement, just a collection of country houses around about midway between those two towns. I have been there in the late afternoon, usually on a Friday, and have seen as many as 20 children learning to play tennis with their mums and dads. As they are so far from town, that is the only opportunity they get to play tennis. Last year I was able to get lighting installed at that tennis court to enable people to play in the evening. From now on those sorts of projects simply will not be funded. They are little things but they are important to our country communities. This year I was looking forward to putting some funding into Pinkett and Mingoola which, as I have said, are little spots on the map which are easily overlooked, but are important when we take into account the delivery of services and facilities to country communities. Under that scheme benefits were out of all proportion to the money made available, yet it has been withdrawn. [Extension of time agreed to.]

The get started program at Armidale, SkillShare and a number of other support programs have been withdrawn, which is a major blow to young people trying to look after their futures and trying to boost their chances of getting jobs by improving their educational capacity. Those programs have been withdrawn in what can only be described as a penny-pinching approach by the Premier who, in my presence, referred to these programs as "make work schemes" at a Chamber of Commerce lunch on Monday. They are not. These
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programs are real opportunities for some of our children to break through the ruck having left school and to get their first jobs. The mature workers and workplace schemes have also been withdrawn, which is a great shame. Those of us who have real contact in the communities know how important those programs were.

A major blow to people in country New South Wales is the cutback in agricultural funding, the closure of the veterinary laboratories in Armidale and Wagga Wagga and the closure of the Biological and Chemical Research Institute at Rydalmere. The closure of these establishments represents a cost shift for farmers. It might save the Department of Agriculture a few dollars, but it will impose greater costs on farmers who send diseased animals for analysis. They will now bear the costs of shipping samples or animals to Camden. That is a major blow to them, given the sorts of pressures they have been under in recent years. Most important, it will put at risk the capacity of industries to produce the wealth that they do for this State.

A major outbreak of an exotic disease in the chicken industry at Tamworth or in some of the beef cattle feedlots throughout the north and north-west would impose a considerable cost on agricultural industries and affect the economy of this State just so a few dollars may be saved - we have not seen any figures - from the closure of that veterinary laboratory. I will do everything I can to get the Minister to change his mind on that woefully stupid decision. If that fails the Government will have to try to find some other way of delivering that service. Many animal industries are located in that area and it is important to us and to those industries to have efficient services close at hand that can be used as and when required at short notice.

I do not have much to say about the housing budget. In Tenterfield only four housing units are to be built - fewer units than I had expected, based on information I have received in recent years concerning average Department of Housing funding. My successor as Minister for Small Business and Regional Development, who is overseeing the turning off of lights in country New South Wales, had the gall to proclaim that next year will be the year of regional development. What a joke! What an absolute farce! He is witnessing all these cutbacks but he still states that next year will be the year of regional development in New South Wales. People will not be able to find their way in regional New South Wales as the lights have been turned off. Next year, which will not be a year of celebration for regional New South Wales, we will continue to shake our heads and wonder what we can do to convince this Government that people with real needs live beyond the mountains.

The state development and small business and regional development budget is reduced this year despite claims by the Minister that there has been an increase. The Consolidated Fund recurrent appropriation is down from $69.8 million last year to $65.4 million in 1995-96 - which, by my calculations, is more than a 6 per cent decrease in the Government's contribution. If the Minister is able to show that there has been a 3 per cent increase in the Government's contribution he is doing different sums. A specific aspect of funding -much of which is shrouded in secrecy and about which there is not much information in the budget papers - is the reduction of funds to the business enterprise centre program, which was $4.6 million last year but which is $3.5 million this year. The BECs are under a committee of review which many believe is a precursor to their being cut adrift by this Government.

Community-supported projects are beginning to deliver real benefits for local business communities. Community-based BECs and BECs in the suburbs of Sydney have Government support. Without that support councils, business groups and chambers of commerce, which are already heavily stretched, will simply not be able to keep many BECs going. Much of the good work that is beginning to bear fruit will go for nought. Other programs of the former Department of Business and Regional Development are under a cloud following a merger of departments concerned with State development, and business and regional development, and the effects are being keenly felt in country New South Wales. For the first time since that specifically directed former Department of Business and Regional Development got under way more than two years ago, people are beginning to say, "It was just a blip. It has gone. We will return to the days when we were being ignored. We are no longer the focus of attention. We are now back under this bigger cloud of State development. We do not even have our own Minister."

That is quite true. We now have an amalgamated department of State development and business and regional development, which happens to have two Ministers - an absurd administrative position - where no-one knows who is the boss. Over recent years there has been an increased focus of attention on country New South Wales. Businesses and regional development were given additional funding, staffing and other resources. There was co-location with chambers of commerce and business enterprise centres in the country. The former Government established the Country Embassy and a World Trade Centre. That centre, which might have been completed by this Government, was commenced by the former Government.

The former Government gave country businesses and regional development offices access to that World Trade Centre. It did all those things under a Minister dedicated to regional development. We now have a hotchpotch of a department with two Ministers. No-one knows who is boss and we
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have lost that focus of attention not only on regional development issues, about which I have been speaking, but also on all small business aspects. They will be lost under a great amorphous cloud and no-one will know which of those two Ministers to talk to because both of them will probably be unavailable on the day. Who will make the decisions at the end of the day? It will probably be the Treasurer, the more senior of the two Ministers. That means that the Minister for Small Business and Regional Development has already been pushed aside in the scheme of things by this Government. It could be said that that is symbolic of what is happening to small business and regional development.

Specific programs for small business and regional development are very much under a cloud, with a real reduction in the Consolidated Fund allocation and a Minister who has been nobbled, just as country New South Wales has been nobbled. Over the next year I am sure we will see a diminishing in the focus of attention on rural New South Wales, small business matters and other specific programs. On a recent Commonwealth parliamentary study tour I was able to show the small business policy document and the regional development strategy document that I introduced in September last year to a number of government representatives. I did not come across anyone who had programs as comprehensive as those developed in this State. I believe that those programs will go for nought because of the winding back of that focus of attention.

Those programs are at risk and under a cloud. We will try to find out during the estimates committee process just what will happen to each of those programs. We know that the funding allocation from the Consolidated Fund has diminished; there have been considerable cutbacks to a range of services, facilities and projects in country New South Wales; and there has been a loss of focus on small business throughout the State. Over the next few years the struggle will be on. Opposition members will try to establish as much information as possible through the estimates committee process and report the implications to the people of New South Wales. It will have to be a good year indeed for regional development if the Minister is to turn around successfully the many cutbacks and closures in country electorates. There is nothing in the budget that gives hope to the small business community.

No-one has said to me, "By golly, we did well under this budget." Everyone is trying to find out whether they have benefited from the budget in any sense at all. The summary view from the small business community is that the budget has nothing for it. It is resigned to battling through for another year hoping that some of the programs under the previous Government will be maintained so that their business skills and the opportunity to compete at world's best practice will be enhanced and business will prosper in the future. Debate on the budget this year has been curtailed. The handing down of the budget was delayed for three weeks. Honourable members did not speak to the debate last week. Until today, honourable members have had little opportunity to participate in the budget debate. Estimates committees will now proceed in the upper House and not in this House.

Mr Martin: It was not of our doing.

Mr CHAPPELL: The introduction of this new procedure was not to be at the expense of the estimates committee process that was available in this House. The Government has no excuse for not submitting Ministers of this House to the accountability process commenced by the previous Government in the interests of the people of New South Wales. But the Labor Party is ducking it. The Government seeks to curtail the budget and estimates committee process. In other words, the Government is chickening out; its Ministers do not want to subject themselves to the scrutiny to which coalition Ministers submitted in the past. The Government has not provided the same budgetary detail as was provided by the coalition in its budget documents. Consequently, it is more difficult for the people of New South Wales, particularly via their representatives on Opposition benches in this place, to know what they will receive from the budget and what the many cutbacks to the small business and regional communities will mean in real terms. The Opposition will strive to obtain that information from the Government over the next few weeks to ensure the people of country New South Wales - [Time expired.]

Debate adjourned on motion by Mr Martin.

[Mr Deputy-Speaker left the chair at 1.03 p.m. The House resumed at 2.15 p.m.]

[Notices of Motion]

[Interruption]

Mr SPEAKER: Order! If the honourable member for Gosford remained quiet, the House would not have difficulty hearing members' notices of motions.


Petition praying that the Rose Bay-Circular Quay ferry service be extended to include a service to the Finger wharf and a link to Manly and Balmain, received from Ms Moore.

Petition praying that the House legislate to ban totally the manufacture, sale and use of steel-jawed leg-hold traps in all areas of the State as they cause great suffering to all animals and birds, both target and non-target, caught in them, received from Ms Moore.

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Petition praying that the Fox Film Studio proposal for the Sydney showground be subject to the conditions set out in the petition, received from Ms Moore.

Petition praying that the House totally and unconditionally abolish animal vivisection on scientific, medical and ethical grounds and that a new system be introduced whereby veterinary students are apprenticed to practising veterinary surgeons, received from Ms Moore.

Petition praying that the Pacific Highway north of Karuah and Tea Gardens Road be upgraded, that the speed limit on Tea Gardens Road be reduced to 80 kilometres per hour, and that a cycle lane be constructed on Tea Gardens Road, received from Mr Martin.

Petition praying that a pedestrian crossing be provided on Newcastle Road, Wallsend, between Bluegum Road and Thomas Street, received from Mr Mills.


Ms MACHIN (Port Macquarie) [2.25]: I move:

That General Business Order of the Day (for Bills) No. 8 be reordered to take precedence on Thursday 26 October 1995.

The reason I seek precedence would be clear to members. The bill is a matter of concern to all members who have received representations from proprietors of small service stations in their electorates who are worried about moves in the oil industry. The industry is also interested to know about the outcome of this issue and would like to see the matter resolved. It has been listed on previous occasions, and the Opposition has attempted to bring it on. We would like business to be reordered so that it can be dealt with.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I am sure the honourable member for Port Macquarie has convinced members that the matter should be given precedence.

Motion agreed to.

Mr McMANUS (Bulli) [2.27]: I move:

That General Business Notices of Motion (General Notice) No. 19 be reordered to take precedence on Thursday 26 October 1995.

Question - That the motion be agreed to - put.

The House divided.

Ms Allan Mr McManus
Mr Amery Mr Markham
Mr Anderson Mr Martin
Ms Andrews Ms Meagher
Mr Aquilina Mr Moss
Mrs Beamer Mr Nagle
Mr Carr Mr Neilly
Mr Clough Ms Nori
Mr Crittenden Mr E. T. Page
Mr Debus Mr Price
Mr Face Dr Refshauge
Mr Gaudry Mr Rumble
Mr Gibson Mr Scully
Mrs Grusovin Mr Shedden
Ms Hall Mr Stewart
Mr Harrison Mr Sullivan
Ms Harrison Mr Tripodi
Mr Iemma Mr Watkins
Mr Knight Mr Whelan
Mr Knowles Mr Yeadon
Mr Langton
Mrs Lo Po' Tellers,
Mr Lynch Mr Beckroge
Mr McBride Mr Thompson

Mr Armstrong Mr O'Farrell
Mr Blackmore Mr D. L. Page
Mr Causley Mr Peacocke
Mr Chappell Mr Phillips
Mr Cochran Mr Photios
Mr Collins Mr Richardson
Mr Cruickshank Mr Rixon
Mr Debnam Mr Rozzoli
Mr Downy Mr Schipp
Mr Ellis Mr Schultz
Mr Fahey Mrs Skinner
Ms Ficarra Mr Slack-Smith
Mr Fraser Mr Small
Mr Glachan Mr Smith
Mr Hartcher Mr Souris
Mr Hazzard Mr Tink
Mr Humpherson Mr Turner
Mr Kinross Mr West
Mr Longley Mr Windsor
Dr Macdonald Mr Zammit
Ms Machin
Mr Merton Tellers,
Ms Moore Mr Jeffery
Mr O'Doherty Mr Kerr

Mr Hunter Mr Beck
Mr Mills Mrs Chikarovski
Mr Rogan Dr Kernohan

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Mr SPEAKER: Order! The persuasiveness of the comments of the honourable member for Bulli has convinced me to cast my vote with the ayes and declare the question to be resolved in the affirmative.

Motion agreed to.


Mr Nagle, as Chairman, tabled the report of the Committee on the Independent Commission Against Corruption entitled "Visit to Brisbane 22-23 June 1995", together with a collation of evidence of the Commissioner of the Independent Commission Against Corruption on general aspects of the commission's operations.

Ordered to be printed.



Mr COLLINS: My question is directed to the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism. Does the Minister stand by his comment of 17 May 1993 that "We believe there is no justification for increasing public transport fares over CPI"? Does he now reject the State Rail Authority plan for massive increases in rail fares of up to 139 per cent and affirm his promise to limit increases to the consumer price index?

Mr LANGTON: Coalition members are having a great deal of trouble adjusting to being in opposition. Whenever they come into this Chamber it is as if they have been away for days -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Ermington to order.

Mr LANGTON: - and they have to re-educated about what has happened in the last week. I will put it simply for them.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Eastwood to order.

Mr LANGTON: The Government Pricing Tribunal was set up by the coalition Government. That tribunal conducts annual reviews of all sorts of things including transport fares, electricity prices and water prices.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Burrinjuck to order.

Mr LANGTON: It was announced by the previous Government that the Government Pricing Tribunal would conduct a major review of public transport, including public transport fares. That review is proceeding.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the Deputy Leader of the Opposition to order.

Mr LANGTON: It is proceeding, and submissions have been received from the State Rail Authority, CityRail, the State Transit Authority and Action for Public Transport. A range of people and organisations have sent submissions to the tribunal. I have not seen a submission from the honourable member for Ermington. Has he put in a submission? What does he think?

Mr Photios: On a point of order: the question that was directed to the Minister was whether he would honour his promise; it did not relate to the Opposition.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! No point of order is involved. The honourable member for Ermington will resume his seat.

Mr Kerr: On a further point of order: I was shocked to hear the Minister address the honourable member for Ermington, rather than address his answer through the Chair.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! No point of order is involved.

Mr LANGTON: In summary, we have an inquiry. Before the last election the former Government announced that there would be a broad-ranging inquiry into public transport fares. That inquiry is progressing. Submissions have been made by a range of organisations and people, and they are being considered.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the Deputy Leader of the Opposition to order for the second time.

Mr LANGTON: I understand from the chairman, Professor Parry, that recommendations will be made to the Government some time early next year.


Mr McMANUS: My question without notice is directed to the Premier, Minister for the Arts, and Minister for Ethnic Affairs. What is the Government's reaction to the tragic death yesterday of Anna Wood? How is the Government tackling the growing scourge of drugs which is affecting our youth?

Mr CARR: Yesterday, at around 4 p.m., 15-year-old Anna Wood died at Royal North Shore Hospital. Her life support system was turned off after she fell into a coma, following taking of the drug ecstasy. On behalf of the New South Wales Government I extend condolences to the family and friends of Anna Wood. Her tragic death is a reminder to our community that illegal drugs are killing our teenagers - ruining their lives and the lives of their families and friends. It is a reminder that in our community there are people driven by greed who continue to peddle death to children. A
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single tablet of ecstasy can be purchased for between $30 and $70, putting it dangerously within the financial reach of many young people.

Ecstasy is manufactured illegally by backyard chemists. It is a synthetic drug similar to amphetamines. It is often cut with junk toxins to maximise dealers' profits. The effects of ecstasy include hallucinations, irrational behaviour, convulsions and vomiting. Acute poisoning can occur, leading to a very fast heartbeat and a very high body temperature. The effects of this are compounded by the physical exertion of dancing, high temperatures in crowded venues, dehydration and combined use with alcohol. The tragic death yesterday of a 15-year-old girl has shattered the myth that use of this designer drug is risk free.

The details of Miss Wood's death are still being investigated, but police advise that it is related to the illegal drug that she took on Saturday night. It may also prove to have been the result of combining under-age drinking with the drug. I can report to the House that a second person, a man, has been arrested and charged in relation to Anna Wood's death. Let me warn anyone who supplies, traffics or manufactures amphetamines that he or she faces a 15-year gaol term or a $200,000 fine if caught. Under the New South Wales Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act, dealers in large commercial quantities of a drug such as ecstasy face a $500,000 fine or life in gaol.

Earlier this year the Government introduced legislation which increased the penalties for adults selling illicit drugs to children under 16 years. It was an election commitment and we honoured it in the first sitting of Parliament. In July 1995 the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act regulation was amended to list also many of the common components of designer drugs as prohibited drugs so that manufacturers of designer drugs can be more easily prosecuted. This morning, at the Government's instruction, two inspectors of the Department of Gaming and Racing were sent to the Phoenician Club in Ultimo to gather information. The Director of Liquor and Gaming has been instructed to commence proceedings in the Licensing Court against the Phoenician Club. We will be withdrawing the club's functions licence to prevent it from holding any further dance parties. We will also be taking action to cancel the Phoenician Club certificate of registration - that is, its liquor licence.

This is the final warning to those who run licensed premises. If under-age drinking and the sale and consumption of drugs such as ecstasy are conducted on their premises, we will come down on them like a tonne of bricks. The Government will move immediately to cancel their licence. There can be no excuse for under-age drinkers being on licensed premises. New South Wales has a photo proof-of-age card available free of charge to anyone between the age of 18 and 25 years to complement the photo drivers licence. This should make it simple for staff to check whether a person is entitled to entry. In another measure to combat under-age drinking, young people are not allowed into licensed clubs, hotels or cabarets unless they are in the company of a parent or guardian. This is aimed at preventing older friends who have proof-of-age cards or licences from taking young people into places where alcohol is available.

In New South Wales schools this year there have been 54 individual incidents in which students have been caught with marijuana at school. Three incidents involved students of primary school age. One year 5 student was found using a bong in the playground of a primary school. One year 6 student caught with marijuana claimed it belonged to his father. In schools the State Government has increased funding for drug education by $5 million over five years. That was one of the first actions of this Government. We will educate students about the dangers of illegal drugs and promote positive peer influence to encourage abstinence. The Government is presently preparing a New South Wales school discipline policy, which will specifically address the possession of a suspected illegal substance. Principals have the power to suspend immediately students who bring illegal drugs and controlled substances on to school premises.

Principals are directed to call in the local police in situations when students have in their possession illegal drugs or a substance being touted as an illegal substance. Students found dealing in drugs at school and hence bringing harm to their colleagues will be subject to the full force of the law. When substances suspected of being illegal are found in the possession of students, principals can access a service providing a definitive analysis of the substance within 48 hours. However, parents have the ultimate responsibility. Parents have the task of ensuring that their children arrive at school ready to learn. If their children's behaviour is unsatisfactory, responsibility rests with them. If the behaviour is criminal, police will be called to the school. Schools are not, and never will be, sanctuaries from the rule of law.

The State Government is stepping up the crackdown by drug enforcement agencies on the illegal manufacture of amphetamines. A special DEA task force is targeting the flow of chemical ingredients to illegal manufacturers. The task force is in daily contact with chemical companies to monitor the movement of chemicals that could be used in the production of these sorts of drugs. Police have powers to raid dance parties under the Theatres and Public Halls Act 1908, the Local Government Act 1993, the Police Service Act 1990 and the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act. If there is a report of illegal activity, including the sale and consumption of drugs, police will investigate. The police Minister today asked the police commissioner to focus increased attention on the drug-related activities surrounding dance parties and rave parties. The Government's approach - focusing on drug
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education, increased police efforts, a crackdown on amphetamine manufacture and a tough stance on liquor licensing - will have some impact. But there will be no greater influence on the attitudes and conduct of young people than their parents and guardians. It is with them that the greatest and toughest responsibility lies in protecting our children from illegal drugs and alcohol abuse.


Mr PHILLIPS: My question is directed to the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism. Does the Minister accept the Premier's proposal to remove responsibility for Rail Net - that is, all the State rail infrastructure - from the transport portfolio and to put it under the control of the Treasurer? Will the Minister be left with a train set with no tracks?

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Gosford to order.

Mr LANGTON: There is no such proposal. Rail reform is being considered by a task force, which will report in due course.


Mr BECKROGE: I ask the Minister for Agriculture, on behalf of my colleague the honourable member for Bathurst, a question without notice. What is the Government doing to protect New South Wales producers from the risk of the spread of the papaya fruit fly discovered in north Queensland.

Mr AMERY: There are four million stories in New South Wales Agriculture and this is another one of them. Based on the performance of the State Opposition, I will have time in government to deliver all of those stories. It is refreshing to know that there are stories to speak about in this House other than the Liberal Party leadership. I was only joking about there being four million stories and having enough time to relate all of them. There are signs that the Leader of the Opposition is picking up his act. The evidence is clear, and the Premier should be warned. The Leader of the Opposition was seen in public over the weekend, after 7 p.m., not wearing a dinner suit. That is incredible. He is homing in on us. I thank the honourable member for Broken Hill for his question on this very serious matter, which affects our agricultural industry more than any of the issues to which I have referred recently. The papaya fruit fly was positively identified on a property six kilometres from Cairns last Thursday, 19 October.

Mr O'Doherty: It is in Queensland?

Mr AMERY: Yes, it is in Queensland. God, you are quick! The honourable member for Ermington had to go for a map, but the honourable member for Ku-ring-gai got it straight away. The papaya fruit fly is the most serious of fruit pests. It is a bigger problem than the Queensland fruit fly because it infests green produce and a wide range of fruits.

Mr Tink: It is not as big a problem as Pat Rogan.

Mr AMERY: Your leadership week was last week.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The honourable member for Ermington and the honourable member for Eastwood will listen to the Minister's answer in silence.

Mr AMERY: The divisions between the Liberal Party and the National Party are widening. Last night two National Party members told me about the honourable member for Eastwood. They said this leadership stuff is nonsense. They told me that if they took the top off his head they would find a can of baked beans. I am ignoring calls to name them; I do not think that would be positive. If members insist, I think it was either PMU or Rosella but I cannot be sure. Today I am announcing a range of measures to prevent the entry of papaya fruit fly into New South Wales, including a ban on any Queensland fruit or vegetable likely to carry the papaya fruit fly. Yesterday I requested my department to prepare a proclamation under the New South Wales Plant Diseases Act which will prevent the entry of any product or thing likely to carry papaya fruit fly from the infested area into New South Wales. The proclamation, signed this morning by the Lieutenant-Governor, prohibits the importation from Queensland of any packaged plant, fruit or vegetable unless it is free from pests or disease.

North Queensland is a major supplier of bananas, lychees, mangoes, avocados - I am making a meal of this - tomatoes and a wide range of tropical fruits to New South Wales Flemington markets. It is estimated that 60 per cent of bananas sold at Flemington come from within an 80-kilometre radius of where the papaya fruit fly has been detected. Currently a breach of the proclamation attracts a fine of $2,000. That is a small price to pay for jeopardising a $700 million industry. As a result I have requested my department to review the level of this penalty. I have been informed by my counterpart in Queensland, the Hon. Bob Gibbs, that it is anticipated that a quarantine zone approximately 150 kilometres south of Cairns will be in place tomorrow. This will mean that all produce originating north of Townsville will be inspected for treatment to ensure that it is free of papaya fruit fly before leaving the zone. No product is permitted movement outside the area unless it has been dipped in a pesticide called Rogor.

Mr Hartcher: Rogan?

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I am sure the Minister used the correct pronunciation.

Mr AMERY: I did say pesticide. Other treatments are being examined. Mr Gibbs, the Queensland Minister, assures me that an eradication program is still feasible and will be attempted in
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Queensland. The protocols for the treatment and quarantine of produce from the quarantine zone are being developed. I have instructed that fruit fly traps be put in place as soon as possible around the Flemington markets, Sydney international air terminal, Newcastle markets, fruit producing areas in the Sydney basin and selected sites on the New South Wales north coast. We must determine whether the papaya fruit fly has infested New South Wales. New South Wales Agriculture inspection staff at Flemington will commence inspecting produce from north Queensland immediately.

The entry of north Queensland produce into the Murrumbidgee Irrigation Area and the fruit fly exclusion zone will be tightened up considerably. This is a question the honourable member for Murrumbidgee should have asked. I would have thought that he would have been concerned about the threat to the Murrumbidgee Irrigation Area. All of us, with the possible exception of the honourable member for Murrumbidgee, believe we must do everything possible to protect our valuable fruit growing areas. New South Wales Agriculture will be requesting the upgrading of quarantine measures at the Cairns airport on flights bound for Sydney.

The impact on the export industry of Australia is not known at this stage. However, New Zealand, Japan and the United States have been looking closely at this outbreak. I can assure the House that New South Wales Agriculture will do everything in its power to prevent the spread of the papaya fruit fly in New South Wales. I urge the public to co-operate in this eradication program and give the same support they have continually demonstrated in respect of the eradication of the Queensland fruit fly since that problem was first identified in 1975. I again thank the honourable member for Broken Hill for his very important question and his continuing interest in rural matters.


Ms MOORE: I ask the Premier, Minister for the Arts, and Minister for Ethnic Affairs a question without notice. Has his Government already signed a 50-year lease for almost all of the showground to a private overseas corporation - Rupert Murdoch's Fox Studios - for a use which will irreparably damage adjacent parkland and adjacent high density residential areas even though when in opposition the Premier supported legislation to protect dedicated public land?

Mr CARR: The answer is no.


Ms MEAGHER: Can the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism inform the House of the Government's action to improve safety measures on the State's rail network?

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Ku-ring-gai to order.

Mr LANGTON: Last night at about 9.55 p.m. a CityRail security guard was shot while carrying out his duties on the platform at Cronulla railway station. Mr David Lightowler, an employee of Ultimate Security, was working as a member of a two-person security team introduced to off-peak trains by this Government in order to enhance passenger safety and security. I am advised that Mr Lightowler spotted an armed man loitering in bushes immediately outside the Cronulla platform fence, and was investigating the situation when he was shot. The shot, which is believed to have come from a .22 calibre rifle, passed straight through his left shoulder and struck a carriage of a train then standing at the platform. No other people were injured.

Mr Lightowler's partner raised the alarm as the offender escaped, and the injured security guard was able to provide a description of his attacker to police. The security guard has since undergone surgery and is in a stable and satisfactory condition. I have contacted Mr Lightowler at the St George Hospital today and I know that all members will join me in expressing the Government's best wishes for his speedy recovery. I am advised that police and State Rail investigations into this incident are continuing. Police are currently examining footage from a closed-circuit television camera installed at Cronulla station as part of this Government's safe stations program. In just seven months in office this Government has achieved what the former Government failed to achieve in seven years. We already have 52 stations on the CityRail network equipped with closed-circuit television and another 28 will come on line by February 1996.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Ermington to order for the second time. I call the honourable member for Ku-ring-gai to order for the second time.

Mr LANGTON: By the end of next year more than 100 stations on the suburban network will be covered by closed-circuit television, both covert and overt. Central monitoring of the closed-circuit system will be phased in over the next two years. Passengers have a right to feel safe on our trains. This Government is meeting its election promise to protect that right. Safe stations, of which Cronulla is one, have a guaranteed staff presence from the first train to the last train. As well as closed-circuit television they have high illumination lighting and passenger help points. The Government is looking also at the establishment of police rooms at high risk railway stations in the metropolitan area. Since 3 October professional security guards such as Mr Lightowler have patrolled the entire city and suburban network. Last night we saw how necessary this initiative is and how effective it has been. The courage of and quick thinking by Mr Lightowler and his partner averted what had the potential to result in a fatality. He and his colleagues, who help to protect our passengers, deserve our support and thanks. The former Government deserves nothing but criticism for its
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failure to protect passengers. Opposition members should be ashamed of themselves for allowing transit police numbers to fall well below the required level, jeopardising the safety of travelling passengers.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the Deputy Leader of the Opposition to order for the third time.

Mr LANGTON: In a second incident last night transit police at central station were able to arrest a man following an incident at the CountryLink booking office. I am advised that a 31-year-old man is scheduled to appear before Central Local Court today. Once again we have a clear demonstration of the success of this Government's commitment to keeping passengers safe. Opposition members agreed with the former Government's decision to slash the number of transit police. This Government is well on the way towards totally restoring that number. We have already restored 44 transit police to our rail system. I am advised by my colleague the Minister for Police that we have fulfilled our promise to restore transit police numbers to 300 by July next year. They will be employed in areas of greatest need, backed up at all times by beat police. These initiatives have been developed with the assistance of the rail unions, which share this Government's concerns about passenger safety. We care about the safety of the people of New South Wales and we are doing something about it.


Mr PHOTIOS: My question is directed to the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism.

Mr Carr: A dramatic question.

Mr PHOTIOS: And it will be a good one too, Bob. You are involved in it.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Premier and the Minister for the Environment will listen in silence to the question of the honourable member for Ermington.

Mr PHOTIOS: Did the Minister resign, threaten to resign, or consider resigning as Minister on 21 August or 22 August this year?

Mr LANGTON: Mr Speaker -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Wakehurst to order.

Mr LANGTON: As I indicated when answering a question asked earlier, members on the opposite side of the House seem to be having a lot of trouble in opposition.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the Leader of the National Party to order.

Mr LANGTON: I heard the question. I have been asked whether or not I resigned. I am Brian Langton, Minister for Transport, this is the Premier, this is Cabinet, this is our backbench -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Wakehurst to order for the second time.

Mr LANGTON: This is the Government. Members opposite are the Opposition. Get used to it!

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Gosford to order for the second time. I call the honourable member for Myall Lakes to order.


Mrs BEAMER: Will the Minister for Consumer Affairs, and Minister for Women inform the House what measures the Government has taken to help owners of faulty swimming pools manufactured by a company called United Fibreglass Industry Proprietary Limited?

Mrs LO PO': Mr Speaker -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Burrinjuck to order for the second time.

Mrs LO PO': I congratulate the honourable member for Badgerys Creek on her excellent first speech last night, which she delivered very professionally. My department became aware of problems with pools made by this company late last year.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Murrumbidgee to order.

Mrs LO PO': I am pleased to inform the House that my department acted swiftly to make contact with all of those affected. It has been in touch with more than 500 owners who experienced problems with UFI pools. Unsightly black spots and white-outs - where the blue colour of the pool becomes bleached - appeared on the pools within a short time after installation.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Coffs Harbour to order.

Mrs LO PO': Those problems have affected not only pool owners in the metropolitan area. The honourable member for Coffs Harbour might well find that there are some aggrieved people in his electorate.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The House will come to order. The Minister for Small Business and Regional Development will remain silent.

Mrs LO PO': If honourable members continue to interject I might go downstairs and call a press conference.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Wakehurst to order for the third time. I call the honourable member for Myall Lakes to order for the second time. I call the honourable member for Vaucluse to order. I call the honourable member for Cronulla to order.

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Mrs LO PO': Swimming pools are one of the biggest investments that many families make - second only to their homes. The experience of seeing this ugly damage to a virtually brand new pool has been traumatic to say the least. The problems were caused by a faulty manufacturing process. Normally the department would attempt to recover the costs of rectification work from the company at fault.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! There is far too much audible conversation in the Chamber. I remind the honourable member for Ermington of my warnings to him yesterday in this regard and that he is already on two calls to order. Members will remain silent while the Minister is addressing the House. If members wish to engage in conversation, they should do so outside the Chamber.

Mrs LO PO': In this case, however, the manufacturer, UFI pools, has gone into liquidation. Having contacted each of the affected owners, the former Building Services Corporation, which is now part of the Department of Fair Trading, advised them of their rights and assisted them in taking steps to get their pools repaired. This process is complete and hundreds of cases of rectification work have now been approved with an expected total value in excess of $5 million.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Northcott to order.

Mrs LO PO': Expressions of interest were called for rectification work on pools all over New South Wales and 23 companies responded.

Mr Richardson: On a point of order: two weeks ago Mr Acting-Speaker Rogan ruled that members should not read their speeches.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! No point of order is involved.

Mrs LO PO': The department has now evaluated those expressions of interest and nine companies will be invited to tender for the rectification work this week. Work should be under way by early December. The first families we will be assisting in this matter will have their pools fixed by Christmas. The department will carefully supervise at critical stages all the repair work so that pool owners and their families experience minimal disruption. An average of five working days will be needed to fix most of the pools, though this may vary depending on landscaping and site access. The case of UFI pools represents the biggest insurance payout under the BSC insurance scheme. Consumers all over the State are the winners in this case. The Government responded speedily to this problem and has acted effectively to protect their rights.


Mr DOWNY: What proof does the Minister for Gaming and Racing, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Hunter Development have to support his claims that there is a network of widespread race fixing within the thoroughbred industry? What evidence of race fixing has the Minister referred to the Director of Public Prosecutions?

Mr FACE: The honourable member for Sutherland raises a matter addressed by the Crime Commission of New South Wales. At the time I became Minister the commission was investigating various allegations made in what are now known as the jockey tapes. Unlike the previous Government and its knee-jerk reactions, I consulted immediately with my colleague the Minister for Police as this issue could have caused harm to the industry. It was decided that rather than have the industry torn apart, and in its best interests, the Crime Commission should ascertain what had happened and what was likely to happen.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I remind the honourable member for Wakehurst that he is on three calls to order.

Mr FACE: As a result, an inquiry was held by Mr Temby, QC, who also found the matter was contentious and could have impinged on matters before the court. Consequently, the matter was referred to me with the view from the Minister for Police, who is Chairman of the Crime Commission, that I should instigate a review. A review was undertaken and the matters are still before the court. It would be an offence for me or for the Minister for Police to divulge any of the matters that were before the Crime Commission. I have no intention of divulging that information in this House because of the conflict that could be caused as a result of the matters before the court.


Mrs GRUSOVIN: My question without notice is directed to the Minister for Small Business and Regional Development, Minister for Ports, Assistant Minister for Energy, and Assistant Minister for State Development. Will the Minister inform the House of the outcome of the tender process for pilotage services on Sydney Harbour and Botany Bay.

Mr SCULLY: I thank the honourable member for Heffron for her question and her interest in Sydney Harbour and Botany Bay ports. I am delighted to inform the House that a new contractor has been selected for the provision of pilotage services on Sydney Harbour and Botany Bay. More than $2 million in savings will flow to the industry from cuts in charges of almost 9 per cent. An open commercial tender process has been conducted by the Sydney Ports Corporation, including an independent representative on the panel, to select a contractor for the pilotage services for a three-year period. In line with the new commercial focus, which is at the centre of the Government's recent corporatisation of the State's ports, a major element of the process was a requirement that the successful tenderer provide direct benefits for port users on three levels - reduced charges, improved services and greater safety.

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Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Port Macquarie to order.

Mr SCULLY: In relation to costs, the tender required the contractor to reduce charges to business by at least 5 per cent. I am pleased to announce that that requirement has been surpassed. The new contractor will provide an 8.8 per cent cut in charges for pilotage services. This cut will save industry an estimated $2.16 million over the three-year period of the contract. I announce today that the tender process has resulted in the selection of Sydney Sea Pilots Proprietary Limited as the new contractor for pilotage services for this city's critically important Sydney Harbour and Botany Bay ports.

Sydney Sea Pilots is a consortium formed by the 18 pilots currently operating at the ports. Under the new contract it will provide pilotage services for an estimated 4,200 ship movements per year for a three-year period commencing early next week. In addition to cost savings, other benefits will flow from the tender and from the Government's recent corporatisation of the State's major ports. A productivity improvement plan has been an essential part of the tender, requiring the contractor to deal with detailed performance and productivity target improvements each 12 months. The contractor is required to improve berth utilisation and flexibility, increased synergy with other service providers within the port community and the removal of any barriers to the attraction of new ship-based trade.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I call the honourable member for Port Macquarie to order for the second time.

Mr SCULLY: The contractor will also be required to achieve by July next year accreditation under an international quality assurance system - AS 9002. This will ensure the highest quality pilotage service possible. The Government's corporatisation of the State's principal ports was a major reform aimed at increasing the efficiency of ports while retaining public ownership of important aspects. Corporatisation has put in place an improved competitive environment at the ports by instituting a new commercial focus. New South Wales ports form the best port system in Australia. The new contract for pilotage services on Sydney Harbour and Botany Bay confirms and enhances that reputation. The Opposition should congratulate the Government on its corporatisation process, as announced today. The Government's corporatisation plan has been an untold success. Do you want to hear about it?

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Minister will address his remarks through the Chair.

Mr SCULLY: I believe the House wants to hear seven minutes worth of the corporatisation program of this Government.

Mr Cruickshank: All it will do is prove how little you know about the private sector. You proved that when you came to Murrumbidgee.

Mr SCULLY: I really should not respond to the behaviour of the honourable member for Murrumbidgee. I shall refrain from responding. I visited his electorate doing the right thing and supporting industry for him. He put proposals to me in my capacity as Minister for Regional Development and I have been happy to support some of those proposals.

Mr Kerr: On a point of order: my point of order is about relevance. The Minister is straying into personal relationships.

Mr Knight: On the point of order: there is a long-held tradition in this House that Ministers can respond to interjections. The honourable member for Murrumbidgee interjected not once, not twice, but on three occasions to provoke the Minister. It is clearly within the standing orders and traditional forms of this House for the Minister to be allowed to respond.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! Although the point of order of the Minister for Public Works and Services has some substance, I ask the Minister to return to the subject matter of the question.

Mr SCULLY: The Murrumbidgee Irrigation Area is important to the growth and facilitation of trade through our ports. I have been particularly interested in trying to harness increased exports through this port system. I will work with the Opposition to ensure that Sydney, Port Botany, Port Kembla and Newcastle are the premier ports of Australia. I look forward to the continued support from the Opposition. Honourable members want to hear about the Government's corporatisation program. It is another tick for the Government; another promise fulfilled. This is a government that fulfils its promises. The Government said it would corporatise ports, and that has been done. I cannot get a question from the Opposition about ports. Opposition members are embarrassed by the performance of the Government.

Mr Collins: On a point of order: it is obvious that the Minister has run out of things to say: he did so some time ago. He is plainly abusing question time. This Government is not prepared to face questions. The Minister is using up time that should be allowed for further questions to be asked of the Government.

Mr Whelan: On the point of order: I would like the Clerks to verify what I am about to say, that the Opposition has already asked five questions during this question time. Her Majesty's Opposition has asked five questions during question time.

[Interruption]

You are a past master, and so is the member sitting next to you.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Leader of the House will address his remarks through the Chair and state his point of order.

Page 2346

Mr Whelan: The standing orders have been complied with. The Opposition has asked five questions during this question time. Unlike honourable members of the Opposition I am very interested in what the Minister has to say.

Mr Knight: On the point of order: as the Leader of the House has said, standing orders provide for a minimum of five questions from this side of the House and five questions from the other side of the House, and honourable members opposite have had -

[Interruption]

They are the standing orders of honourable members opposite. They are the standing orders brought in by honourable members opposite.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I do not wish to hear further argument on the point of order. The Minister will conclude his answer as expeditiously as possible.

Mr SCULLY: The only time running out in this debate is the time the Leader of the Opposition will continue to be the Leader of the Opposition. I am very happy to inform the House of the Government's reform program. It is quite different. If honourable members opposite had been elected they would have flogged off the ports. That is what they would have done - they would have sold them off. They are embarrassed by the fact that the Government can tell the people of New South Wales that it is about polishing the family silver, but honourable members opposite would have flogged it off. Where is the Leader of the Opposition off to?

Mr Kerr: On a point of order: Mr Speaker, you have admonished the Minister a number of times and asked him to get back to answering the question. He has complained that he has not been asked questions by the Opposition. It has been explained to him by the Leader of the House, that the Opposition has asked a number of questions and he should proceed with the answer to the question.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I will not hear further points of order on the matter. It is obvious that the Minister was about to conclude his answer.

Mr SCULLY: I only have a few more remarks to make on this particular -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Minister will resume his seat. The time for questions has expired.

Questions without notice concluded.


Mr AQUILINA (Riverstone - Minister for Education and Training, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Youth Affairs) [3.23]: I would have thought that, following the tragic events of yesterday and the unprecedented amount of comment about the untimely death of Anna Wood, Opposition members would have joined with the Government to debate this motion now, rather than trying to prevent it coming on as a matter of urgency. It is a matter of the utmost urgency for a large number of reasons that affect each and every one of us on a personal basis. The motion is urgent because there would not be a parent here today, a teacher within this State, a member of the community, a commentator - indeed, a concerned citizen - who would not be outraged by the untimely death of Anna Wood and the disastrous manner in which it occurred.

Earlier today the Premier outlined a number of issues relating to drug taking in this State. It is a pernicious evil, it is a hidden evil, it is a prevalent evil and it is an evil that has the potential to hit and hurt every one of us in this society. It is therefore timely that we turn the attention of the House today to this issue, to debate the reasons that such a tragedy could occur, and to consider what we can do as a government, what we can do as parents, what we can do as community leaders, and what our schools can do to prevent such tragedies happening again. It is not good enough to put off such a motion until tomorrow, next week, next month or next year. Some may argue that such a debate has been put off for too long already, that if we had concentrated sooner and in a more serious way on the evils of drug taking and how it is affecting our youth today, perhaps Anna Wood would not be dead today.

I feel very strongly about this most serious matter. We cannot waste any time debating this issue. It is all very well for Opposition members to bleat about the motion, but I can assure them that if they want to turn this motion into a political issue, they are making a big mistake. This issue is not about politics; it is of concern to each and every one of us. It is as much a concern to honourable members opposite, as individuals and as community leaders, as it is to everyone on this side of the House. I welcome the opportunity, and I hope the Opposition will respond in kind, to debate this matter in the way in which it should be debated today. I welcome any constructive comments that the Opposition may have about this motion.

It is the responsibility of each and every member of this House, while the community is expressing an opinion about this matter, to debate this issue. One has only to tune in to every half-hour radio bulletin, to listen to talkback radio, or to listen to talk in the streets to know that people are concerned about it. For that reason this House should debate the issue and express an opinion on it. The House should point out quite clearly and plainly to the community at large why it is dealing with this matter now: to put at ease the minds of parents, of students in our schools, of teachers, and of the rest of the community in relation to this matter. It is all very well for the honourable member for Ku-ring-gai to play cheap political tricks, but he should contribute to the debate in a positive way. We should all respond to the urgency of this matter, and do so in a positive way. [Time expired.]

Page 2347

Mr PHILLIPS (Miranda - Deputy Leader of the Opposition) [3.28]: It is with great sadness that I speak about the urgency motions, particularly given the Government's self-gratifying and patronising manner of dealing with the issue. The matter is so serious that it should be debated by a means other than an urgency motion. If the Government were to bring on a full and open debate about drugs, security and problems with kids, I am sure the Opposition would support it. But to indicate there is ongoing drug problem that bedevils every society and to use this opportunity to grandstand is quite sickening.

Mr DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Order! I suggest that the member confine his remarks to the subject matter of his notice for urgent consideration.

Mr PHILLIPS: I understand that I have to explain why the subject of my motion is more important than the Government's grandstanding. This is the first time as a member of this House that I have seen such behaviour from any government to use this type of issue to its advantage. The subject of my urgency motion has to be dealt with in this House today because it concerns a decision about the New South Wales electricity industry that goes before caucus tomorrow. This House needs to debate this issue now. We will not have much opportunity for debate after caucus meets tomorrow and gags the honourable member for East Hills, the honourable member for Bathurst, the honourable member for Newcastle, the honourable member for Wallsend, the honourable member for Lake Macquarie and the honourable member for Swansea. This House is entitled to debate this issue urgently today. Labor's decision to break up Pacific Power will diminish this State's major electricity generator, and will allow the electricity industry to be dominated by our Victorian neighbours. The Government's decision will help Victoria rather than the people of New South Wales. There is no guarantee, despite the Government's assurances, that the break-up of Pacific Power will lead to lower electricity prices. There is no proof that Pacific Power has to be broken up to achieve lower prices.

Mr Gibson: On a point of order: the honourable member is debating the subject rather than giving the reason his motion should have urgency.

Mr Whelan: On the point of order: the honourable member is going to the substance of the debate. The Opposition does this all the time, debates the substance of the motion. The honourable member has an opportunity in the five-minute period allotted to him to prioritise the subject of his motion. Instead, he has offered a lame-duck excuse that he regards the subject of his motion as being more important than this House debating the most important issue facing this State and nation today. Yet the honourable member wants to talk about prioritising this matter. The Opposition should stick to real priorities.

Mr DEPUTY-SPEAKER: Order! The Deputy Leader of the Opposition will confine his remarks to seeking to convince the House that his motion should receive priority over that of the Minister.

Mr PHILLIPS: My motion is important because the Government is driving headlong into a brave new world of national competition without producing an economic analysis, as required under the national competition policy. That policy states that the Government must do it. It is urgent that the House debate this issue before the Government makes a decision on it tomorrow. My motion is urgent also because the break-up of Pacific Power will cost between 2,000 and 3,000 jobs in the electricity and coalmining industries, and will have a severe impact on our ability to export steaming coal. That is why this issue is urgent, and must be debated today so that the Government will come clean on the issue. The competition policy statement says that before competition is introduced - [Time expired.]

Question - That the motion for urgent consideration of Mr Aquilina be proceeded with - put.

The House divided.

Ms Allan Mr McManus
Mr Amery Mr Markham
Mr Anderson Mr Martin
Ms Andrews Ms Meagher
Mr Aquilina Mr Mills
Mrs Beamer Ms Moore
Mr Clough Mr Moss
Mr Crittenden Mr Nagle
Mr Debus Ms Nori
Mr Face Mr E. T. Page
Mr Gaudry Mr Price
Mr Gibson Mr Rogan
Mrs Grusovin Mr Rumble
Ms Hall Mr Scully
Mr Harrison Mr Shedden
Ms Harrison Mr Stewart
Mr Hunter Mr Sullivan
Mr Iemma Mr Tripodi
Mr Knight Mr Watkins
Mr Knowles Mr Whelan
Mr Langton Mr Yeadon
Mrs Lo Po'
Mr Lynch Tellers,
Mr McBride Mr Beckroge
Dr Macdonald Mr Thompson

Page 2348

Mr Blackmore Mr D. L. Page
Mr Causley Mr Peacocke
Mr Chappell Mr Phillips
Mr Cochran Mr Photios
Mr Collins Mr Richardson
Mr Cruickshank Mr Rixon
Mr Debnam Mr Rozzoli
Mr Downy Mr Schipp
Mr Ellis Mr Schultz
Mr Fahey Mrs Skinner
Ms Ficarra Mr Slack-Smith
Mr Fraser Mr Small
Mr Glachan Mr Smith
Mr Hartcher Mr Souris
Mr Hazzard Mr Tink
Mr Humpherson Mr Turner
Mr Kinross Mr West
Mr Longley Mr Windsor
Ms Machin Mr Zammit
Mr Merton Tellers,
Mr O'Doherty Mr Jeffery
Mr O'Farrell Mr Kerr

Mr Carr Mr Beck
Mr Neilly Mrs Chikarovski
Dr Refshauge Dr Kernohan

Question so resolved in the affirmative.


Mr AQUILINA (Riverstone - Minister for Education and Training, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Youth Affairs) [3.40]: I move:

That this House recognises the importance of effective drug education to prevent the destructive effects of youth drug abuse, and urges the Government to maintain its strong stance on comprehensive preventative action.

Yesterday I received devastating news from the Department of School Education that a former student of The Forest High School, Anna Wood, aged 15, lost her life after taking the drug ecstasy. As I said earlier, this tragedy affects our whole community. I am sure I speak, as the Premier did earlier, for all members of this House in extending our heartfelt sympathy to Anna's parents and family, and to her school. This incident underlines the fact that drug abuse is a continuing problem threatening young people in our State. Indeed, they get younger and younger. It is a problem that we must continue to treat with the utmost seriousness, and as a community we must continue to search for effective solutions to prevent the problem. I was deeply moved this morning, while speaking to the principal of The Forest High, Mr Pat Kidd, to hear his plaintive cry:

How can we as teachers overcome the impact of drugs when there is so much in the community which condones it?

He said also:

For impressionable adolescents there is much which says ‘drugs go along with a successful life'.

He told me that constantly young people are being bombarded by popular cultures talking up drugs, and pop groups which are into drugs. He said he recently listened to a radio program on which the compere asked, "Is everybody bonging on?" He said, "We cannot match the charisma of pop groups which are into drugs." He also said, I think quite appropriately, that the media must start to give a message about drugs, and not just an isolated message that drugs are bad. The media frequently advertises that drugs are bad and that youth and others must say no, but much of what is portrayed in the media condones drugs. Groups and subcultures are promoted, particularly among our youth, in which drugs are not only accepted, they are synonymous with success. Mr Kidd said, "Anna Wood could have been thousands of students from thousands of schools." I concur with that thought-provoking statement. Anna Wood was not an isolated person - indeed, she could have been the daughter of any one of us, attending any school in New South Wales and Australia.

Let us look at the statistics. What is the nature of the drug problem? About 13 per cent of those who are 14 to 24 years old used amphetamines at least once in 1993; 5 per cent of males and 9 per cent of females aged 14 to 24 years used ecstasy at least once in 1993. Those figures are taken from a national household drug survey. In 1991, 2 per cent of the total population used ecstasy at least once, and in 1993, 3 per cent of the population used the drug at least once. However, less than half of 1 per cent is recent usage. Marijuana is used on a weekly basis by 30 per cent of those who are 16 to 24 years old, and experimentation with the drug has increased among the school-age population, particularly boys.

The two most abused drugs are alcohol and cigarettes, with 80 per cent of those who are 16 to 24 years old drinking regularly. Of those, one-quarter would regularly have in excess of five drinks in one sitting. That is defined by the Department of Health as binge drinking. From 1989 to 1992 there has been a 5 per cent increase in the number of 16-year-old school students who smoke - 32 per cent of females and 26 per cent of males are smokers. The proportion of students who have smoked a cigarette has also increased. Over 40 per cent of the post-school youth population regularly smoke cigarettes.

That leads to the conclusion that amphetamines, although used at an unacceptable level, are not the major part of the drug challenge. Tobacco and alcohol remain the drugs with the most damaging immediate and long-term effects on young people as a group. Together, those drugs cause 90 per cent of all drug-related deaths in Australia. Among youth, alcohol is the primary cause of drug-related deaths. In fact, alcohol is implicated in over
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half of all deaths of 16- to 24-year-olds. According to medical advice, the drug ecstasy alone is not responsible for death or serious harm. Typically, a combination of ecstasy and high-exertion activities like rave parties lead to dehydration, which then leads to other complications such as heart failure.

The key drug trends relate to gradually increasing tobacco and alcohol usage in 16- to 24-year-olds, especially females. In public high schools reports for this year indicate that only 6 per cent of critical incidents relate to the use of illegal drugs. The vast majority of those incidents - indeed over 75 per cent - relate to marijuana. Incidents involving amphetamines, sedatives or other stimulants account for only about 10 per cent of those incidents. This year the department has been advised of three government school students who have died from drug overdoses. All those deaths occurred outside the schools, either overnight or at weekends. Drug abuse in primary schools is virtually non-existent; it is overwhelmingly an issue for teenagers in secondary schools.

The question may well be asked: what are we doing about drug abuse in New South Wales? The Department of School Education attacks drugs in schools on four fronts. First, it provides preventive drug education for students. Second, it assists students to develop skills for avoiding drug abuse. They need to know refusal strategies in the context of peer group pressure. Third, it promotes positive alternatives to drug use amongst students and self-help programs for students involved in drug use. Fourth, it encourages parents to share with schools the responsibility for drug education programs and to work with schools to ensure that they are drug-free zones.

The Department of School Education receives approximately $1.3 million annually from the Department of Health to support school-based drug education across the State. Non-government schools also receive funds for this purpose. These funds are part of the national drug strategy. Across the State 15 officers with responsibility for drug education provide curriculum support materials, teacher training, ongoing support and policy advice for school-based drug education programs. TAFE also offers a range of drug and alcohol programs aimed at reducing the prevalence of abuse and the harm it causes. It targets work-related and social abuse of drugs, and targets both illicit and legal drugs.

TAFE also has a unit which monitors drug and alcohol use among students, and trains staff to effectively impart to students skills to reduce drug use. This provides a continuous preventive service. I am proud to say that TAFE is also playing a key role in developing responsible serving practices for people being trained in the hospitality industry. We want to make sure bartenders and publicans take drug issues seriously and have enough knowledge to exercise their responsibility to ensure their patrons are not inebriated. Schools and parents share responsibility for the drug problem. As the Premier announced, we will ensure that public schools do not tolerate illegal drugs. Suspension will occur immediately if a substance being touted by a student is believed to be illegal, or it is confirmed by police as being in fact illegal. Under arrangements made with the Police Service, such substances will be identified within 48 hours of its being handed to police by the school principal. The cost of identification is to be charged to the department, and the Police Service will hold the substance pending any legal action against the student and parents.

But schools can only do so much. Most drug abuse occurs outside the school, yet it affects the classroom environment. Parents are responsible for the behaviour of their children, and they have the task of ensuring that their children arrive at school ready to learn. Unfortunately in a number of cases that is not so. If a child's behaviour is unsatisfactory, the responsibility rests with the parents of the child. If such behaviour is criminal, police will be called to the school. Schools are not, and never will be, sanctuaries from the rule of law. Students found dealing in drugs at schools, and bringing harm to their colleagues, will be subject to the full force of the law. In the 1995 budget $1 million has been allocated to combat drugs. This will go a long way towards solving the problem. [Time expired.]

Mr O'DOHERTY (Ku-ring-gai) [3.50]: On behalf of the New South Wales Opposition I express deepest sympathy to the family of Anna Wood. My sympathies go also to the students at The Forest High School; its principal, Pat Kidd; and the staff of the school, who have experienced the tragedy of the life of a 15-year-old girl being taken well before time. As a parent, when I heard the news I was shocked, horrified and overcome with sadness. My wife and I have discussed the sadness of this matter at breakfast over the past couple of days. The fact that the lives of many young people are similarly affected is an indictment of society. We are all accountable, not just one person. We have a broad social responsibility to ensure that this does not happen to young people.

The Opposition joins with the Government to condemn the drug culture. The Parliament must lead the attack against this blight on society. However, I say reluctantly that Opposition members consider it in bad taste that the Government has sought to move such a motion for purely political reasons. I hope that as a member of Parliament I will not see again a party seeking to politicise the death of a young person. I know that other members of the Opposition are of a like mind.

The honourable member for Davidson, the member in whose electorate the young lady resided, will have more to say about the impact of politicising this event. The Opposition dissociates itself from such a blatant politicisation. It is for the Minister for Education and Training and the Leader of the House ultimately to state their motives for
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moving this motion today. The Minister spoke about surveys of drug abuse among young people. The figures hide the fact that there is a broad culture of acceptance of the use of drugs in our society generally. We must examine ourselves in relation to that matter. Those who enjoy alcohol or cigarettes are as much to blame for the culture among young people as the young people themselves. Certainly, we should not judge young people who become caught up in a culture in which, as the Minister rightly said, to be regarded as a success one must be involved with drugs.

The media and the image makers of our society are not without blame also. Often images thrown at young people telling them what they should be, who they should be and who they should aspire to be contain the pernicious message that success is accelerated drug use and involvement in the drug culture. Society must hang its head in shame because images depict young people of today - as young people of past generations were depicted - as being involved with drugs. The message seems to be that the way to get on, the way to popularity, and the way to look good in front of mates and friends is to do those things that will ultimately lead to one's destruction.

It is a sad commentary that too often we use things that are destructive to construct an image for ourselves, whereas the correct approach is to look within ourselves for positive values and to construct ourselves around those positive values. We must construct meaning in our lives through our relationships with people and, I believe, our relationship with God. We must construct our lives around positive values, rather than negative values that will ultimately destroy us. It does not occur only through a drug culture; it also occurs as a result of excessive materialism. Of course, from the United States - we seem to borrow so many youth cultures from that country - we get a direct line on excessive materialism, and that leads ultimately to a drug culture. Originally ecstasy was regarded as a yuppie drug; affluent people used to buy it. These days it is available fairly cheaply on the streets of Sydney; it is certainly cheap enough for young people to buy with their pocket money.

In the same culture affluence is everything, and ultimate materialism, rather than relationships between people, is regarded as the highest ideal. The culture relies on things artificial to get a high. When I reflect on the young people with whom I am in contact, and those with whom I have had contact over the years, I recall experiencing no greater high than that which was obtained from being involved in a performing ensemble, in doing a great job in front of an audience, doing well in a dance group, playing well on the sporting field, debating well or being highly regarded by friends for doing something of value in the community. Those are the great highs of life. We do not need artificial substances to get on a high. Natural highs are much more satisfying in the end.

The latest surveys show that marijuana has taken over as the second most commonly used substance among under-age people, particularly in high schools. That is, it has overtaken tobacco use. We need to ensure that our policies in this area take full account of that fact. Young people seem to be reflecting on the health aspects of tobacco and, in some cases, alcohol. However, as the Minister rightly said, there are many available statistics on binge drinking by young people. It is not as if new opinions cannot be formed in the minds of young people on such issues as health, the environment and so on. We are doing that all the time through education and some media cultures. But in some cases those same media cultures promote other illegal substances and give the impression that some are not harmful. Young people today get the impression that marijuana is not a harmful drug, and that they can happily smoke marijuana because it will not affect them in the same way that tobacco or perhaps alcohol might affect them. It is a fraud that may lead to their death. Within the marijuana culture, into which young people are drawn, there is easy acceptance of other drugs such as amphetamines and ecstasy.

Mr O'Farrell: It's the cocktail that kills.

Mr O'DOHERTY: It is the cocktail that kills, as the honourable member for Northcott reminds me. I understand the need to attack drinking and smoking, as alcohol and drug authorities have argued over the past few years. But we must also examine the reluctance to attack other illegal drugs. It is not appropriate simply to attack drinking and smoking and to allow a sort of wink-wink, nudge-nudge acceptance of other forms of so-called recreational drugs. Such substances will destroy our children's lives, and we cannot stand by and let that happen. I wish to raise a number of matters relating to drug education in New South Wales schools. I take issue with some of the ways in which the Government is addressing the problem. In particular I am concerned about its relationship with external agencies, the peer support foundation, life education centres, the centre for education and others.

I am concerned also about the impact that the restructuring of the Department of School Education will have on the Parliament's ability to deliver programs. Of concern is the number of people within the department who are working on drug education today. I believe there are fewer now than in previous years. I do not wish to engage in a political debate today. The Government's attempt to politicise this matter in order to congratulate itself is distasteful, and the Opposition dissociates itself from the exercise. It is an absolute disgrace. We will have a debate about drug education policies on another day. Today is a day of mourning.

Mr WHELAN (Ashfield - Minister for Police) [4.00]: This is not a crude attempt at politicisation. As members are all aware, there is a need to focus on such issues as this while they are still firmly in
Page 2351
the public consciousness. Tragically the death of this young lady, Anna Wood, has again demonstrated the devastation caused by drugs. It would be irresponsible of any government not to address this issue. I have no qualms at all as a Minister of the Government in stating that my priority is the preservation of young people, not what may or may not happen at an ALP caucus meeting. Talk about politicisation! The Opposition could have moved its political motion tomorrow. I do not know how the honourable member for Davidson, in whose electorate The Forest High School is located, will explain to his constituents why he voted against this motion coming before the Parliament today. He has got some explaining to do.

I am realistic enough to know that whatever governments do there will always be some people in our community who risk both their health and their freedom by taking illegal drugs. Therefore I make an appeal to young people: if you or your friends take illegal drugs or partake of alcohol and become ill, you should not hesitate to seek medical help. In fact, this should be your first priority. Above and beyond any fear you may have of the authorities, your first thought should be your safety and welfare and the safety and welfare of your friends. Human life is too valuable. As the Jewish Talmud says, "Every child born has a message for the human race." We all have to work together to avoid a repeat of the tragedy that occurred last weekend.

My ministerial colleagues have informed the House of initiatives in their portfolio areas to educate and warn about the dangers of drugs. The New South Wales Police Service is also taking positive steps to educate and inform people about, as well as to enforce, the laws pertaining to the illegal drug trade. I would like to mention a couple of positive anti-drug initiatives which are currently under way. I have spoken before about the crime prevention workshop programs that have recently been extended statewide in secondary schools. The program presents an opportunity for teenagers to mix with local police, to learn about the consequences of risk-taking behaviour and to develop strategies to reduce the temptation of drugs and crime. These workshops are also addressed by Department of Health representatives, who specifically discuss the effects of drugs. Some members of this House - the honourable member for Cabramatta and the honourable member for East Hills - have attended these workshops in their local communities. They have reported to me their overwhelming enthusiasm for the initiative and have confirmed the existence of positive feedback, particularly from local kids.

At the enforcement level police consistently gather intelligence to use in launching effective anti-drug operations. For example, Operation Noah, the annual anti-drug phone-in, is used to gauge drug-taking habits and any changes in trends. I am advised that reports are followed up and as a result positive leads have emerged into those responsible for high level drug manufacture and supply. These leads are currently being investigated. Over the past two years there has been a dramatic increase in the number of calls received about amphetamines. As a result the drug enforcement agencies have established a task force to target the illegal manufacture and supply of the drug. The Police Service and the Department of Health are cooperating in this operation.

The interdepartmental approach is targeting the availability of chemical ingredients in order to cut off the supply at the source. Let me give a stern warning to those who deal in death and despair. It is only a matter of time. Let this be a clear warning: you only need to be caught carrying one tablet of the so-called designer drug ecstasy and you will face two years in gaol and/or a $2,000 fine; you have to ask yourself whether it is really worth the risk. I am delighted to support the motion and the Premier's remarks in response to a question asked of him in question time. I congratulate the Minister for Education and Training on the great work that he has done in this regard. I salute the Police Service for what it is doing, particularly Senior Constable Darren Steadman, who has been involved in the crime prevention program in schools throughout New South Wales. When I attended one of those crime prevention seminars involving young students at a school in the inner west, the principal of the school told me that as a result of the three-day seminar the attitude of young people in the school towards the school, the principal, authority generally and police in particular, had changed for the better. It is no wonder that I, as Minister for Police, will be encouraging the New South Wales Police Service in that endeavour.

Mr HUMPHERSON (Davidson) [4.05]: I represent the community in which The Forest High School is situated. I am sure all members of the community and honourable members of this House experienced a chill when they read the article and saw the photograph of Anna Wood on the front page of today's Daily Telegraph Mirror. They made me realise just how close our homes and communities are to drug-related deaths. On behalf of all members of this place - especially the honourable member for Wakehurst - and my local community I offer condolences to the family and friends of Anna Wood. The local community is a very close one; I am sure all its members feel very strongly about this issue.

I acknowledge the strong offers of support from the Forest High School and its principal, Pat Kidd. All members of the school community are deeply saddened and affected by this episode. I was particularly distressed by the manner in which this matter was raised in the House today. The ministerial statement of the Premier was appropriate, but the way the Government has sought to follow up with this motion is disappointing. I shall not respond to the comments made by the Leader of the House in his contribution to debate,
Page 2352
but I draw to his attention allegations of drug taking and drug activities on the school oval immediately behind the Frenchs Forest police station.

We all need to focus on drug education. Ironically, two or three years ago I held a public meeting on drug education at The Forest High School, for which I received strong support from the principal and the school community. There was a recognition then that the impact of drugs can often be felt very close to home and that we needed to be just as vigilant in the more affluent areas about that matter as we are in the not so affluent areas of our city. We need to ensure that the resources to maintain that vigilance are available right across the community. We have responsibilities as members of the community and as members of Parliament to establish laws to deter offenders and to provide for penalties that will punish in the strongest manner possible those who are motivated by greed to exploit young people.

Unfortunately, the use of drugs by young people and their availability and accessibility are very high. Today the principal of the school was quoted in the paper as saying that drugs were available at the Chatswood and Manly transport interchanges. Young people can obtain drugs without any difficulty - a matter which clearly has to be addressed. I continue to advocate the drug education of young adults and children, which clearly is an important arm in the process of reducing drug usage. As I said earlier, this problem is not limited to less affluent suburbs; it can affect us all at any time without notice. Unfortunately, today our community has been badly affected by the death of Anna Wood, and all members would agree with the sentiments expressed in the motion. I endorse the actions of the Premier, who is seeking to close down the Phoenician Club and other locations which encourage or assist young people to take drugs. [Time expired.]

Dr REFSHAUGE (Marrickville - Deputy Premier, Minister for Health, and Minister for Aboriginal Affairs) [4.10]: I also support the motion and welcome the bipartisan support for it. Havoc is being wreaked on our society because of the use of illegal drugs. That is not to say, of course, that legal drugs are not a problem, for they certainly are. But our focus today is on the use of illegal drugs and their effect on young people. Interestingly, in 1993 a national household survey found that 3 per cent of those surveyed Australiawide had tried ecstasy or other designer drugs, and 1 per cent had used them in the last 12 months. In response to another question, 8 per cent of the population reported that they had used amphetamines - 2 per cent in the last 12 months - and 3 per cent of the population reported that they had used cocaine or crack. In 1993, 13 per cent of people aged between 20 and 24 had tried ecstasy; 19 per cent had used amphetamines; 6 per cent had used cocaine; 17 per cent had used hallucinogens; and 5 per cent had injected drugs.

In 1993 there were three deaths in New South Wales from accidental poisoning associated with the use of psycho-stimulants, and in 1990 there were two deaths. Accidental poisoning from illicit drugs other than opiates and barbiturates was responsible for 98 deaths in Australia in 1992 and 50 of those deaths were in the 15-year-old to 34-year-old age group. I have no doubt that the figures are higher than those exposed by that national survey. The tragedy is that the young lives that are being destroyed - young lives that should be productive - are our hope for the future. I, and I am sure all honourable members, certainly accept the suggestion that we should be doing more. We need better drug education and training programs for children at a very young age. But we need more than education. It is not just the education system or governments in general that can make a difference.

The fact that the Minister for Education and Training, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Youth Affairs is being supported by the Minister for Police and me demonstrates the need for a whole-of-government approach. Many factors are involved in this issue, and one of the factors highlighted by the Premier is that we need to spend some time contemplating the need for families and parents to accept their responsibilities. It is not easy being a parent these days with so many things changing. It has probably been said by every parent that modern times are harder than they were in our days. We are facing challenges that we have not faced before. How are we to be productive and ensure that our children grow up healthy and have a positive attitude to life?

We must recognise the role that parents should play and we must provide them with support. Many parents start their parenthood without any understanding of what it will be like. In fact, many of my colleagues, on the birth of their first child, have said that they were not aware how their lives would be changed by having a child. Difficulties can arise if parents have no support and have to handle problems. Dysfunctional patterns can develop from the interaction between a parent and child, which can lead to problems such as child abuse. When children become adolescents they experiment with drugs and engage in other dangerous activities. If there is no communication, parents are not able to impart their wisdom to their children to ensure that they understand what is being offered to them and have the ability to say no.

We should not blame anyone for this unfortunate incident. We should certainly try to find a solution to this drug problem, which is a scourge on our society. But we must ensure that when there are cries for help, there are places where those cries will be heard and that there are people to provide support. One of the messages today should be that if parents are worried about their children they should not forget about them; they should take the matter seriously and seek help. Help is available, whether at schools or community health centres or on anonymous phone-in lines.
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There are people who know what those parents are going through and they are there to help. I encourage parents to assist the Government in finding a solution to this problem. [Time expired.]

Mr AQUILINA (Riverstone - Minister for Education and Training, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Youth Affairs) [4.15], in reply: I thank all honourable members for their contributions to this debate. Some Opposition members made a few negative comments, but they were relatively minor. Overall, the debate has been positive. I empathise with the honourable member for Davidson. I know what it is like to represent an electorate that has suffered a major tragedy. It is never easy for members to talk about things such as this in this Chamber. I was the member for Blacktown when Anita Cobby's parents suffered their terrible tragedy. That incident occurred three streets away from my home and I know what it is like. I know how the Minister for Police felt earlier this year when he and a cohort of boys from Trinity Grammar School attended the funeral of Peter Savage. We were all outraged by the death of Michael Marslew, just as we are outraged today by the death of Anna Wood.

These tragedies are not pleasant, but they are major motivators in affecting public opinion and making governments do things. It was important for us to debate this matter urgently because these issues are of great concern to each and every resident of this State, to every parent and to every legislator. I extend to the honourable member for Davidson my sincere sympathy. I know he will perform his task - as would any member of Parliament - by conveying appropriate sentiments to the family of Anna Wood and to the school. This morning I did as much to Pat Kidd, the Principal of The Forest High School. His plea to me, besides the others I mentioned earlier, was, "Please make people aware that The Forest High School is not a school where drugs are easily available." Apparently, some people are placing that tag on the school. It is important for that point to be made in this House today.

The Forest High School, which has a great reputation, has the motto "Excellence across the Curriculum". The honourable member for Ku-ring-gai would know that it has an enviable reputation for performing arts - the sorts of things he was talking about earlier that give young people a buzz and a great high. I had the opportunity of observing much of their work. I, the Minister for Police and the Minister for Health have not attacked the previous Government on these issues. We have not sought to make this a political debate. We have not congratulated ourselves on anything we have done, because that is not appropriate in these circumstances. Everyone should focus on this issue today, and again I invite Opposition members to come forward with positive statements about it. The honourable member for Ku-ring-gai has said he would be only too willing to do so.

The Government has been in office for only a short period and has not been able to directly and dramatically influence issues of this type, which everyone would agree would take years to achieve. However, the Government wants community support for its work and it wants the benefit of having everyone's opinion. Tragic as it may be, Anna Wood's death will focus our attention in a way that nothing else can on this pernicious evil that is so prevalent among many young people in our society. The facts and figures have been put forward about the dilemma facing policy makers. Those facts and figures must be addressed and the right policies must be formulated. I welcome the input of the community, its leaders and commentators in helping the Government reach the right decisions.

Motion agreed to.


Mr PHOTIOS (Ermington) [4.21]: I move:

That this House censures the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism for misleading Parliament on both the issues of further subsidies to bus operators and cuts to bus services that follow his changes to the School Transport Subsidy Scheme.

In recent weeks there has been enormous angst in the community about the Minister's administration of his portfolio and particularly the savage cuts to the school transport subsidy scheme. In the last few days the Minister - at best carelessly, at worst destructively; or reflecting his lack of competence - has chosen to say one thing to bus and coach operators and the community outside the Parliament and another to members in this House. It is this issue that goes to the very heart of discharging one's ministerial responsibilities with integrity, honesty, professionalism and competency. Though the Opposition is reluctant to move against the Minister so early in his mismanaged career, we consider it is appropriate to take him to task for his administration of this portfolio, and particularly for his misleading the community. I have received many phone calls from bus operators who of course, like most of the industry, feel that the Minister is largely irrelevant in the Cabinet and to the management and operation of his portfolio. The bus operators are concerned about exactly what the Minister meant at a so-called joint press conference with the Bus and Coach Association on the steps of the Parliament. On 23 October the Australian Associated Press reported that the Minister said:

Operators are eligible for increased Government subsidies if they believe a particular service cannot be provided on fares alone.

That statement has been verified and confirmed by countless journalists in this building. I am careful to quote directly from reputable sources in the
Page 2354
media that are independent of the Government and the Opposition. The AAP wire report of 23 October led with this statement:

The State Government today conceded -

that is an interesting point -

that the bus services in Sydney's fringes -

that demonstrates a degree of ignorance -

would be affected by cuts to the free transport scheme. Transport Minister Brian Langton refused to confirm or deny -

probably because he did not know, does not know and is not capable of knowing -

reports that operators were being forced to wind up hundreds of route services to stay in business. He said the real impact of the cuts was not quantifiable -

again because he has not done his homework -

but ruled out massive cuts to services.

On one hand he does not know the answer, but on the other he is prepared to at least make that clarification. The report continued:

The Government would ensure that no commuter was disadvantaged by cuts to services. There may be some effect on smaller services, particularly in fringe areas of metropolitan urban areas -

Mr Langton: On a point of order: I am sure all honourable members appreciate the attempt by the honourable member for Ermington to assist those who are print handicapped by reading large slabs of articles in recent wire reports. However, I do not feel it is appropriate to the debate. The honourable member must be able to verify the veracity of those quotes before he can use them.

Mr PHOTIOS: On the point of order: nothing is more central to this debate than whether the Minister said or did not say something. He and I will take umbrage with that in the course of this debate. I am happy to detail specifically that I am referring to a media wire that was the subject of widespread media speculation. If I cannot refer to what the Minister said in the public arena, the debate cannot proceed.

Mr Langton: Further to the point of order: it has been established in this House on many occasions that if a member is to use a newspaper as the basis for debate, he must be able to absolutely verify its veracity. The honourable member cannot do that and, therefore, does not have the right to use that material.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The point taken by the Minister for Transport is that if the member wishes to quote from a document, he should do so only briefly and he should identify the document from which he has quoted.

Mr PHOTIOS: I am referring now to an AAP wire that was used by the media - television, print and radio; all of whom were present and can verify it.

Mr O'Farrell: And it has never been disputed.

Mr PHOTIOS: It was never disputed by any journalist downstairs who heard the Minister say that there would be subsidies for bus operators. The Minister has twice misled the public. On one hand he has told operators they will be eligible for increased government subsidies. Then in this House he has denied his commitment of the previous day about subsidies to bus operators to maintain services. As reported in Hansard of 24 October, the Minister said:

There will not be any backdown on the Government's decision, because the decision is the right one . . . I did not make that statement yesterday.

All of the journalists downstairs were somewhat surprised at that comment. I spoke with many of them today and none can reconcile the Minister's statement in the House with the statements he made outside the Parliament. It is fair to say that there is now confusion amongst senior officials among bus and coach operators as to what precisely the Minister means. The Minister is aware that these cuts will savage bus routes and will impact upon hundreds of thousands of bus commuters. On 12 October in the Daily Telegraph Mirror journalist Ben English reported:

BCA spokesman Roger Graham said because each bus service would cost $50,000, the Government's aim to save $100 million could result in 2000 route closures, if most parents chose not to pay for their children's fares.

He said that industry surveys, not those of the Government or the Opposition, confirmed that as a reality. Under that scenario, New South Wales faces a critical future. Battling families will suffer from savage cuts to the school transport subsidy, and when the $24 tax is imposed kids will be exposed to dangerous risks on the streets because their parents will not be able to afford to send them to school by bus. Despite the Minister's protestations about capping this scheme and the impact on commuter services across the board - which affects pensioners, workers, mums and dads, shoppers, in fact everyone because bus routing, not just school bus routes, will be cut back - he stands condemned and censured today for misleading the House by saying there were to be no subsidies.

To say twice in this House, and outside to the Bus and Coach Association and the public, that there would be no subsidies makes him either a fool - and that is not hard to accept, given his current performance - or incompetent. Senior level members of his department certainly think he is incompetent. The industry thinks he is irrelevant. It paints a grim picture of a Minister for anti-public transport. The scheme is getting out of control; every day another story breaks in the media. The Minister wants to contain it, and no doubt the Premier tells him to pull it into line, but he cannot. It is out of control. But the worst is yet to come. Next year thousands of families will have to pay for this Minister's follies, and leading up to the next
Page 2355
election hundreds of thousands more will not have bus services because of this man's battle against public transport. He is flying in the face of a social justice policy and a social equity policy that we demand in this House.

It is also fairly clear that the Minister has used his scant knowledge and appreciation of this issue and sought to mislead the House about cuts to services. Here it is even more graphic. It is so clear as to bring home to the Minister the sad and sorry truth. I think he should apologise to the House for misleading it in relation to services. On 12 October, as reported in Hansard, he said, "There will be no loss of services, whether by route buses or school buses." That statement was without qualification. It was a short sentence that this Minister is capable of getting out - not getting right, but getting out. But this week - it only took him a couple of days - outside the Parliament he said, "There may be some effect on services, particularly on the fringe of metropolitan areas" - and even credited himself as the perpetrator of the changes - "as a result of changes to the school transport subsidy scheme."

He wants to have it both ways. He wants to get parents punch-drunk on a scheme of change, which he says in the House will lead to no - none, unqualified, full stop - reduction in services. Then a couple of days later outside the House he said that it will have an effect. He concedes that the industry knows it will have an effect, and he knows the industry is right. He acknowledged that my point is right, by conceding that he got it wrong when he misled the House last week, as reported in Hansard. Clearly this Minister has got it wrong twice. He is at least required to apologise to the mums, dads and kids whose safety is at risk because of his lack of integrity, his lack of honesty and his lack of sincerity in pursuing this issue. It continues today. RailNet is the latest misconception. RailNet is to be separated from his portfolio and he knows it.

Mr Langton: On a point of order: the motion clearly relates to buses, not to trains. I ask that the honourable member be directed back to the leave of the motion.

Mr PHOTIOS: On the point of order: I was but making passing reference to demonstrate a catalogue of misleading of the House. There is a parallel, giving that -

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I uphold the point of order. The motion is quite specific.

Mr PHOTIOS: It is very clear from the nature of these cuts that hundreds of thousands of people will be affected by Langton's folly, as it is known in the industry today. That is the new approach to a policy designed to take 200,000 kids who now enjoy the right of free travel to a free school; a policy supported with absolute consistency by the coalition Government for seven years, even when various departments suggested that it be reviewed. We rejected that suggestion. We did not Yes Minister these proposals like this bloke did. We did not Yes Minister the proposals of the Treasury. The Public Accounts Committee made a very modest proposal when the coalition was in Government, but that also was rejected as we strongly supported the right of students to free travel to free education.

With 200,000 kids suffering, with 2,000 routes going, with bus operators on the breadline, with hundreds of buses to go, this Minister smiles. His industry is suffering so acutely that hundreds of buses will be taken off routes and thousands of bus routes will be cut, yet he smiles at the damage he wreaks. He is responsible for cutbacks in his public transport portfolio. He cannot offer commitment to infrastructure. Now he wreaks havoc on children whose safety is at risk, whose families will have to battle with a parent tax of $24, and on bus operators who will have to take services off the road. He is a Minister for anti-public transport. That will be the hallmark of his career as he faces a Cabinet reshuffle in a few months. He is a clayton's Minister: the Minister we had to have when we did not want him. He is the Minister whom this Premier wants to get rid of as quickly as he can. There will soon be a Cabinet reshuffle and this Minister will be removed, as he should be. Today's motion, even if on party lines it is not passed, makes it very clear that this Minister's days are numbered as the industry looks at him increasingly critically and with contempt. [Time expired.]

Mr LANGTON (Kogarah - Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism) [4.36]: I have no intention of wasting the time of the House on the specious yappings of the honourable member for Ermington, so I will keep my response as brief as possible. I want to point out to the honourable member for Ermington that today is the anniversary of the Charge of the Light Brigade. I should also warn him that his pathetic attempt to attack this Government over much-needed and very long overdue changes to the school student transport subsidy scheme will end in the same tragic way as that tragic battle did 141 years ago. Yesterday the honourable member for Ermington asked me if I stood by my comments that I would "Provide financial support to bus operators who would otherwise have to axe services", to which I replied, "I did not make that statement yesterday." I was right yesterday. I am right today. But I can tell honourable members who is wrong: the honourable member for Ermington. The honourable member for Ermington has it completely wrong, but I do not think that would come as a surprise to anyone in this Chamber. He has got it wrong before. He got it wrong when he said rail fares would rise by 300 per cent. He got it wrong when he said he had documentary evidence to prove his case. He was shown to have got it wrong when the discerning journalists in the press gallery of this Parliament demanded that he produce that non-existent documentary evidence. As we all know the honourable member for Ermington -

Page 2356

Mr Photios: On a point of order: Mr Speaker, a short while ago you ruled that RailNet was outside the leave of the motion. Train fares which may or may not go up and which I may or may not have commented on are not related to this motion. In fact, only a few minutes ago, the Minister pointed out that trains were not the subject of this motion. I would ask you, Mr Speaker, to direct the Minister to exercise some intellectual discipline and stick to the motion, which clearly relates to buses and bus policies.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member has drawn a very fine line. No point of order is involved.

Mr LANGTON: The incredible and almost unlimited ability of the honourable member for Ermington to get it wrong was amply demonstrated in his comments in the Daily Telegraph Mirror this morning. He said that I promised to invoke the Public Transport Act to increase subsidies as a last resort. I quote:

Under the Act . . . operators are eligible for increased Government subsidies if they believe a particular service cannot be provided on fares alone.

Unfortunately, the honourable member, who on most days has trouble finding his way along Macquarie Street, has no idea what he is talking about. What he said this morning is absolutely incorrect. He did not even have the name of the Act of Parliament correct. It is quite simple. The Passenger Transport Act - not the Public Transport Act - covers two types of contract, commercial and non-commercial. Non-commercial contracts refer to services that are fully remunerated by the Government on a fixed rate that reflects the cost of providing the service and an appropriate rate of return for the investment involved.

Non-commercial contracts do not have a minimum service level requirement. They simply require a service to be provided irrespective of the level of patronage. Then there are commercial contracts, and these contracts do have minimum service levels. Even the honourable member for Northcott knows that. He should tell his mate, the honourable member for Ermington. Commercial contracts do not provide subsidies to unprofitable bus routes. That is the legislation. Revenue for commercial contracts comes from passenger fares, not from Government subsidies. School student transport payments are revenue for the half-fares for students carried on those buses. Commercial contracts also include revenue that is a reimbursement for the provision of half-fare concessions for pensioners and the unemployed.

If an operator on a commercial contract considers a particular route has become unprofitable, it is up to that operator to design and market his services over the whole of the contract area to maintain profitability. Commercial contract holders do not receive subsidies for particular services and therefore cannot receive increased subsidies. I really have trouble getting that message through to the honourable member for Ermington. I take advice from that well-known canine trainer, Barbara Woodhouse, who keeps saying that the only way to leave an indelible message is to repeat, and repeat, and repeat a message to try to get it imprinted in the brains of even the dullest. Here I go again; I will try once more to get it through to the honourable member for Ermington.

There is no backdown on the Government's reforms of the school student transport scheme. The reforms are set in concrete. Bus route services will be maintained. I repeat that the Government is happy to look at operators' claims on a case-by-case basis - as I have been saying for the last couple of days. The Department of Transport will provide technical advice to operators who consider that some of their routes may be unviable. Any operator who wishes to vary his commercial contract will need irrefutable evidence that the changes are in the best interests of the travelling public and the taxpayer. If an operator is not prepared to maintain the terms of his commercial contract, the Government may be forced to call tenders for a more efficient operator to take over.

That is exactly what has been said inside and outside this Chamber for days. At the press conference to which the honourable member refers I did not use the word subsidy. The honourable member has the transcript of the interview. The word subsidy was not used. I did not say we would provide a subsidy. I said we will look at assistance on a case-by-case basis. Assistance can be in all sorts of forms, as I have outlined in this House during the last couple of days. I said in this House last week - the honourable member quoted from Hansard what I said last week - that there would be no reduction in services. I stand by that: there will be no reduction in services. The honourable member also quoted that I said outside this House that changes may have some effect on operators. Yes, I stand by that, too: of course it may have some effect on operators.

We will therefore take whatever action is appropriate to make sure services are maintained. How even the thickest of members opposite - the honourable member for Ermington - can suggest that somehow there is a dichotomy, I do not understand. I do not intend to waste the Parliament's time dealing with the mad yappings of the honourable member. The Department of Transport and the Bus and Coach Association are continuing their discussions on the implementation of the school students transport scheme reforms. I can assure all members of the House that there is an enormous degree of goodwill on both sides. I can assure the honourable member for Ermington that these reforms will be implemented and route services will be maintained. I reject the motion out of hand.

Mr O'FARRELL (Northcott) [4.47]: I listened carefully to the Minister, hoping that he would answer the very serious charges brought by
Page 2357
the honourable member for Ermington in this debate. What we got from the Minister, as usual, was no answer. He is a bit like one of those comic texta balloons - all balloon, no answers. He is running out of steam, and he has absolutely no answers.

Mr Whelan: I am next. Be careful.

Mr O'FARRELL: I accept the bipartisan show of support. If the Minister for Transport keeps performing as he is in the House - hopelessly - Bob Carr will actually date his letter of resignation, it will be submitted to the Governor, and the honourable member for Auburn will be fitted for his ministerial car at long last.

Mr Harrison: On a point of order: the honourable member for Auburn, who has nothing to do with this debate, has been mentioned. I ask the honourable member for Northcott, who has tried in such a disgusting manner to draw the honourable member for Auburn into this debate, to apologise.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The Chair accepts that the reference by the honourable member for Northcott was to illustrate in a humorous manner the point he was making.

Mr O'FARRELL: I am sure there will be enough ministerial reshuffles over the next four years that even the honourable member for Kiama will finally make it to the ministry. This debate is about two issues - about cuts to services, and about subsidies to bus operators. I may be a new member in this House, like the member for Peats, who is trying to interject, but the good news is that I was not educated under a Labor education system, and the better news is that I can read plain English. On 12 October the Minister was asked by the honourable member for Ermington, "Will he guarantee no loss of bus services to either school students or the State's commuters?" That simple question required a simple answer.

Mr Photios: From a simple man.

Mr O'FARRELL: From a simple man, indeed. The Minister said it twice in his reply. The first time he said, "There will be no loss of services, whether by route buses or school buses." He went on to say, "To summarise, there will be no loss of services to people who need to use buses in New South Wales, whether by route buses or school buses." It is interesting to note that that is not what he said outside this place on 23 October. Mr Speaker asked earlier that if I or the honourable member for Ermington quoted media material, we source it. We are happy to source it. The source is Australian Associated Press and it is dated 23 October.

Mr Langton: On a point of order: I raise the same point of order I raised earlier. If members use quotations from newspapers or wire services as the sole basis of a debate in this Parliament, they have to be able to confirm the veracity of that report.

Mr O'FARRELL: On the point of order: when I worked for a Minister once upon a time, most Ministers had access through their offices to the AAP wire. There has been no retraction through the AAP wire of that statement. The Minister has had two days to do so. There can be no point of order.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The essence of my observation is being lost. I said that only passing reference can be made to newspaper articles.

Mr O'FARRELL: The passing reference is that on 23 October the Minister said outside the House there may be some effect on services, particularly on the fringe of metropolitan urban areas, as a result of changes to the school student transport scheme. Clearly that is misleading the House. That is exactly what the motion is about, and the honourable member for Ermington deserves congratulations once again for exposing this Minister. The second issue relates to subsidies for bus operators. Yesterday the Minister was asked by the honourable member for Ermington:

How much has the Minister set aside for every bus and coach operator in his new subsidy scheme announced yesterday, resulting from his decision to cut the free school transport scheme? When will he announce the guidelines for the new bus operator subsidy scheme?

In answer the Minister said:

Contrary to the implied statement in the question of the honourable member for Ermington, at no stage yesterday did I mention the word "subsidy".

Again I will mention in passing the AAP wire service which states:

Operators are eligible for increased Government subsidies if they believe a particular service cannot be provided . . .

Mr Whelan: On a point of order: this is a matter of censure, not a matter of speculation. It is a very important point. If you want to have a resolution in this House that is based on newspaper reports you are going to have to do a hell of a lot better than that.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member's time for speaking has expired.

Mr WHELAN (Ashfield - Minister for Police) [4.52]: This is the greatest waste of time I have ever seen. A Minister of the Crown is being censured because of an alleged newspaper report. Even former Speaker Rozzoli would not have been bold enough to have permitted anything like that to be presented in his party room. The honourable member for Hawkesbury would have put his foot down and said, "You cannot do that." The honourable member for Ermington is giving veracity to everything that is said in the newspaper so he can use it in the House and, in this case, against a Minister. This motion is a waste of time. The honourable member is depriving members of their rightful opportunity to address the Appropriation Bill. No evidence has been provided, except the most flimsy, indirect evidence out of an
Page 2358
alleged newspaper report - not more than one, but only one alleged newspaper report. The honourable member for Ermington has displayed his complete ignorance and lack of knowledge. His failure to provide proof will result in his resolution being lost. Frankly, I was so moved by what the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism said, there is no way he should be censured. I move the following amendment:

That the motion be amended by leaving out all words after the word "House" with a view to inserting instead the following words:

"commends the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism for his success in bringing efficiencies and effectiveness to transport services in New South Wales after seven years of neglect and maladministration of the previous Government."

That is what the resolution should be. The honourable member for Ermington has had a political lesson today. Regrettably, the Minister for Transport has educated the shadow minister on the various administration Acts, that is, the relevant statutes that fall within the administration of the responsible Minister. The Minister told him what legislation applies. Fools should not be educated at any time, but the honourable member for Ermington has proved an exception today. I shall tell the Minister for Transport I do not want him to educate these fools any more, I do not want him to take them through the Acts of Parliament for the purpose of educating them. There has been no evidence. The Minister said commercial contracts do not provide subsidies for unprofitable bus routes; there will be no backdown on the Government's reforms to the school students transport system - they are set in concrete; bus route services will be maintained; the Government is happy to look at operators' claims on a case-by-case basis; and the Department of Transport will provide technical advice to operators who consider some of the routes to be unviable.

The difference between the various contracts must be understood. The Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism must stop educating members of the Opposition about statutes in his portfolio and about commercial contracts, or he will be in trouble. Any operator who wishes to vary a commercial contract will need to provide irrefutable evidence that the changes are in the best interest of the travelling public and of the taxpayer. The Minister for Transport has answered those questions fairly and squarely. The Opposition has yet to provide any evidence. The honourable member for Ermington has shown his lack of knowledge and understanding by trying to obtain proof from a newspaper report. It is a wonder it did not come from the "Bullamakanka Times"! He wants to give veracity to anything that appears in a newspaper to suit his own purposes, to waste the time of this Parliament by bringing a serious resolution, namely, a censure of the Minister for Transport. The honourable member for Ermington should be censured, because he is a time waster. This debate has proved that he is a fool, and that he is not on top of his shadow portfolio, because he has been given an educational lesson today in this Chamber, but he did not take it.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The behaviour of the honourable member for Ermington is most disrespectful. This is not the first time the member has attracted the adverse attention of the Chair in this regard. I warn him that a repeat by him of such behaviour will result in his removal from the Chamber. I suggest that other members contain their enthusiasm and allow the honourable member for Gosford, who seems particularly eager to do so, to address the House.

Mr HARTCHER (Gosford) [4.56]: Truth is the first casualty of war, and truth is the first casualty of this Government. If ever a government was built upon lies and deceit it is the Carr Labor Government, not only in relation to its lies in March but its persistent lies and dissembling of the truth since then. The Minister has been caught out not only for his incompetence but also for his lack of veracity. For that reason this House is meeting this afternoon to censure him, as he rightly deserves to be censured. He no longer possesses the confidence of this House or of honest people throughout New South Wales. This is the man who said, on 12 October in relation to the budget, that there will be no loss of services, whether they be group buses or school buses. Outside the Parliament this very week he said there may be some effect on services, particularly on the fringe of metropolitan-urban areas as a result of the changes to the school student transport scheme. The Central Coast Advocate reported, in an article about this Minister and this Government:

A major sticking point in Bob Carr's first budget is the change to the school bus pass system.

The article continued:

The government should thrash out the problems with the bus companies and leave the students alone . . .

Mr SPEAKER: Order! Was the honourable member for Gosford not in the Chamber when I ruled on the use that members may make of newspaper articles?

Mr HARTCHER: I am only quoting, Mr Speaker, I am not citing this at all.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! That is exactly the point I made. The member may make only passing reference to such articles; they cannot be used to establish fact. The member is quoting directly from it.

Mr HARTCHER: I am not quoting it as a fact.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member is quoting it directly. I ask him to desist.

Mr HARTCHER: The Central Coast Advocate stated, in the closing words of the article, "You've run off the road with this one, Mr Carr." Not only the lack of credibility of the Minister is at
Page 2359
stake, well attested though it is, but the lack of credibility of the Government is at stake. Nonetheless, this censure is devoted to him. It is your day today, Brian. You deserve a day and you are getting a day.

Dr Refshauge: On a point of order: Mr Speaker, you have ruled many times, particularly resulting from Opposition points of order, that members should be referred to by their correct titles.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I uphold the point of order. Standing orders provide that members should be addressed by their correct titles.

Mr HARTCHER: The Minister has run off the road. He has not only run off the road but also betrayed the people and little children of this State. At the end of the day that is what this is about. It is not simply about money; it is about the Government and the Minister putting money ahead of the safety of little children. If ever there was a man with a lack of ability and lack of capacity to stand up for the children of this State whom he is supposed to be assisting through the school bus transport system, and if ever there was a man caught out, it is this particular operator. Not only did he resign on 21 August and not attend the Cabinet meeting on 22 August; he went on television the following day and denied that he had resigned. What did he do when that question was put to him in Parliament this afternoon? He ducked it; he dingoed it. He was not prepared to lie to the House, as he was prepared to lie to the 3 million people who saw him on television denying that he had resigned. They all saw the Minister deny it on television, yet he was not prepared to say that in Parliament this afternoon.

Mr Harrison: On a point of order: the honourable member is introducing matters that are well outside the leave of the motion. He is talking about allegations of resignations and so on, which are not mentioned in the motion.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! I uphold the point of order. The motion is specific.

Mr HARTCHER: The Minister should be censured not only for his serial resignation but also for misleading the House. He told the people of this State that operators are eligible for increased government subsidies if they believe that a particular service cannot be provided by fares alone. However, at question time today the Minister said that there will not be any backdown on Government assistance. The Minister should resign because he is a disgrace to the Parliament and to this State. [Time expired.]

Dr REFSHAUGE (Marrickville - Deputy Premier, Minister for Health, and Minister for Aboriginal Affairs) [5.01]: This is an unbelievable waste of time. The Opposition is trying to censure the Minister for Transport for allegedly misleading the Parliament on two issues. The first issue relates to whether the Minister said that subsidies would be provided to bus operators. Clearly, the only alleged evidence that the Opposition has is a report by Australian Associated Press. Opposition members have refused to vouch for the accuracy of that report. They have refused to put themselves on the line and say that the report is accurate. They know that if they mislead Parliament in that way they will be turfed out. They are not prepared to say that the report is accurate. Indeed, the accuracy of the report was described by the honourable member for Northcott when he held up three fingers and said that there were only two reports. There is a lot of counting going on there.

Mr Hartcher: On a point of order: the motion before the House is clear. It relates to the censure of the Minister for Transport; it does not relate to any activities in which the honourable member for Northcott may or may not be engaging.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! No point of order is involved. The Deputy Premier is responding to what the member said in his speech.

Dr REFSHAUGE: The Opposition has moved a serious motion but it not prepared to vouch for the accuracy of the report on which it claims the Minister allegedly misled the House. The Opposition also said that the Minister misled the House in regard to cuts to bus services. The Minister did not mislead the House; he said it exactly as it is. He said that there would be no cuts, and there are no cuts. As the Minister explained, as a result of the changes there may be some reconfiguration of services but there will be no cuts. If the children of this State need those bus transport services, the Minister has guaranteed that they will receive them. If bus operators want help, the door is always open for the Minister to provide that help.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! There is far too much interjection. The Deputy Premier will be heard in silence.

Dr REFSHAUGE: Just as the honourable member for Northcott showed his amazing incompetence with regard to accounting, the honourable member for Ermington was unable to find something to say on an incredibly dismal day for the Opposition. When we were in opposition we experienced sitting through tactics meetings, thinking "My God, there is nothing going on". In the early days we could not find anything to do. Members opposite are facing the same problem. All they can do at the moment is talk about leadership challenges. The honourable member for Ermington, with his great expertise of leading the marginal seats campaign, could not see what was happening across the border in the Gladesville electorate.

Mr Photios: On a point of order: the motion is not about electoral boundaries. The Minister should come back to discussing the reconfiguration of routes, to which he referred.

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Mr SPEAKER: Order! I uphold the point of order. The Deputy Premier will return to the leave of the motion.

Dr REFSHAUGE: It is obvious that the motion has no substance - there is not a skerrick of substance to it. This is a desperate Opposition. I suggest that members opposite go and look after their electorates, rather than fight among themselves trying to work out who will be the next Leader of the Opposition and wasting the House's time by moving such spurious motions. I will be supporting the amendment.

Mr LANGTON (Kogarah - Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism) [5.06]: There is nothing to reply to. What has been put forward by the Opposition today is absolutely baseless and has no veracity. For the Opposition to have the hide to move such a supposedly serious motion against a Minister, without any evidence whatever, is wasting the time of the House. It is a waste of time and money when there are many other important issues to be discussed. There is simply nothing to reply to. All I can do is urge honourable members on both sides of the House to support the erudite amendment. With a degree of humility I shall read it:

. . . commends the Minister for Transport and Minister for Tourism for his success in bringing efficiencies and effectiveness to transport services in New South Wales after seven years of maladministration by the previous Government.

Only one significant thing has happened today as a result of the motion: the sliver of credibility that the honourable member for Ermington had before today has gone.

Mr PHOTIOS (Ermington) [5.08], in reply: A censure motion is a critical debate for a Minister. The most salient feature of this debate was revealed by the Minister's colleague, the Deputy Premier. I am sure that the Deputy Premier was speaking on behalf of the Government when he announced that the Government's new solution, the mark III solution, to the savage cuts in services for the public is reconfiguration of the timetable. The Minister for Transport said that there would not be cuts in services. There is no greater evidence of the Minister's lies and his lack of credibility than the fact that one of his colleagues got up in his defence and conceded that there would be changes - he called it reconfiguration. I ask the Minister how he could better describe cuts to services by a government defending itself than as a reconfiguration. The Deputy Premier's message to bus operators - I shall leave the Minister alone for a moment because the Deputy Premier is our focal point, given the Government's announcement - is that the new approach of the Government, when condemned for its cuts, is to announce that it will make the cuts. The Government's defence is that it is consistent.

The Deputy Premier said that there will be a reconfiguration. By definition, he re-emphasised the statement made by the Minister for Transport during the joint press conference with Roger Graham of the Bus and Coach Association. I want to emphasise that our case does not rest solely on the misleading statements made in this House by this Minister, or simply on the Australian Associated Press wire. It has also been confirmed broadly by the press gallery and by the Bus and Coach Association. The Daily Telegraph Mirror, a newspaper for which I have great regard, has tenaciously taken up this case, day in, day out, pursuing the Minister in relation to these bus cuts. In its latest exposé, bar one - yesterday's coverage - it indicated that the threatened bus routes were on the Minister's agenda and that there may be a reprieve. Last week in this House the Minister for Transport, and Minister for Tourism said there will be no loss of services, whether by bus routes or school buses. This week in Parliament he said there may be some effect.

Let us just focus on those two phrases. Last week there will be no loss of services; this week there may be some effect. Blind Freddie knows that Langton's folly is being unfolded in a tragic story today. This question relates not just to the Minister's credibility. It relates also to the impact on hundreds of thousands of commuters, not just the kids, mums and dads who will have to pay, but the pensioners, workers, and mums and dads who will want to use bus services. Mr Roger Graham says 2,000 services will be cut. The Minister asks where the evidence is for this assertion about the Minister's commitment. There can be no greater evidence than that given yesterday, in front of the Minister, by the chief spokesperson for the Bus and Coach Association, who said, "The Minister stated unequivocally that they will be looked at." He confirmed the Minister's commitment. I do not think a bus operator could ask for any more.

The bus operators of this State need this new bus transport subsidy scheme that has been announced. The new scheme announced by the Minister during the last week will clearly cost a lot of money, but the Minister does not know how much. In the Daily Telegraph Mirror he is quoted as saying that it is impossible to estimate how much protecting services would cost. In yesterday's Daily Telegraph Mirror the Minister was quoted as saying that he did not know how much it would cost. I have been given an estimate by bus and coach industry sources that confirms it will cost millions of dollars, because thousands of services will be cut, and hundreds of buses taken off the roads, yet the Minister maintains that there will be no loss of services, whether by route buses or school buses.

The Opposition would like the Minister to tell the House how the subsidies will be paid. The Minister said the Act enables the Government to provide a financial contribution to operators in order to subsidise their services if they cannot operate on fares alone. The Minister has given the same advice to the bus and coach industry. There are only two ways of providing that financial support. Either the Government adopts the approach taken by
Page 2361
the Deputy Premier, that is, to reconfigure, rewrite, reduce and cut services - something the Minister has been desperately trying to avoid admitting - or it provides a fist full of dollars.

As Alan Jones pointed out to the Premier on his radio program yesterday, $100 million will not be saved. Alan Jones asked the Premier how he could save $100 million on the school transport subsidy scheme on the one hand, yet provide bus operators with a new subsidy scheme to bail them out financially, and at the same time maintain services. Of course Mr Jones got it right, as he often does. The reality is this Minister has got his sums wrong and the $100 million will be severely cut back by as much as $50 million when the services have to be supported. Every bus operator and coach company will be able to apply for financial support under the Act. Every one of them is entitled to have this Minister and his department provide financial compensation so that there will be no loss of services, whether by route buses or school buses. In other words, if you cannot raise it through the fare box, the Government will provide a cross-subsidy.

The Minister has misled the House in relation to cuts to services. Outside this House he said there would not be a loss of services, but in the House he said there will be. Outside the House he said that bus operators are eligible for increased Government subsidies, but in the House he said there would not be any backdown, and that he did not make that statement. Today, on Rail Net, on his resignation, on one issue after another, this Minister has demonstrated gross incompetence, a faulty memory, and an inability to maintain a consistent line. He cannot tell the truth. He will not tell the truth. He will not stand by the bus and coach industry. One day he offers support and the next he retracts it. He deserves to account for these tawdry lies. Langton's folly will haunt him next year when the services are cut. In 1997 when the cap of $450 is introduced, every student -

Mr O'Farrell: On a point of order: on three occasions now during my service in this House the Minister has threatened me. I would seek your advice on matters of privilege.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! If the member wishes to make a personal explanation, he should do so at the appropriate time.

Mr O'Farrell: Mr Speaker, I seek your advice on a matter of privilege.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The member should seek such advice at the appropriate time.

Mr PHOTIOS: This Minister has lied to the House on a number of occasions. Yesterday he continued when he said that the first railway station to be opened in 60 years was at Warabrook. But the Minister got it wrong: it was Metford station that was opened in March. The Minister did not know that a couple of months ago a new railway station had been opened at Metford. Time and time again the Minister fails to do his homework and he gets it wrong. He misleads the House with perennial relentlessness. His actions will haunt him just as soon as the damage resulting from these savage changes to the school transport subsidy scheme is felt early next year. [Time expired.]

Question - That the amendment be agreed to - put.

The House divided.

Ms Allan Mr Martin
Mr Amery Ms Meagher
Mr Anderson Mr Mills
Ms Andrews Mr Moss
Mrs Beamer Mr Nagle
Mr Clough Mr Neilly
Mr Crittenden Ms Nori
Mr Debus Mr E. T. Page
Mr Face Mr Price
Mr Gaudry Dr Refshauge
Mr Gibson Mr Rogan
Mrs Grusovin Mr Rumble
Mr Harrison Mr Scully
Ms Harrison Mr Shedden
Mr Hunter Mr Stewart
Mr Iemma Mr Sullivan
Mr Knight Mr Tripodi
Mr Knowles Mr Watkins
Mr Langton Mr Whelan
Mrs Lo Po' Mr Yeadon
Mr Lynch
Mr McBride Tellers,
Mr McManus Mr Beckroge
Mr Markham Mr Thompson

Mr Armstrong Mr O'Farrell
Mr Blackmore Mr D. L. Page
Mr Causley Mr Peacocke
Mr Chappell Mr Phillips
Mr Cochran Mr Photios
Mr Collins Mr Richardson
Mr Cruickshank Mr Rixon
Mr Debnam Mr Rozzoli
Mr Downy Mr Schipp
Mr Ellis Mr Schultz
Mr Fahey Mrs Skinner
Ms Ficarra Mr Slack-Smith
Mr Fraser Mr Small
Mr Glachan Mr Smith
Mr Hartcher Mr Souris
Mr Hazzard Mr Tink
Mr Humpherson Mr Turner
Mr Kinross Mr West
Mr Longley Mr Windsor
Dr Macdonald Mr Zammit
Ms Machin
Mr Merton Tellers,
Ms Moore Mr Jeffery
Mr O'Doherty Mr Kerr

Page 2362

Mr Aquilina Mr Beck
Mr Carr Mrs Chikarovski
Ms Hall Dr Kernohan

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The vote being equal, I give my casting vote with the ayes and declare the question to be resolved in the affirmative.

Amendment agreed to.

Motion as amended agreed to.


Mr WEST (Orange) [5.26]: I move:

That the sessional order setting out the days and hours of meeting during the Budget Sittings be amended by inserting after "Thursday 26 October 1995 9.00 a.m.-7.00 p.m." the following dates and times:

"Tuesday 31 October 1995 2.15 p.m.-10.30 p.m.
Wednesday 1 November 1995 9.00 a.m.-7.00 p.m.
Thursday 2 November 1995 9.00 a.m.-7.00 p.m."

Today is the last day on which the Leader of the House can give notice of Legislative Assembly estimates committees. His failure to amend Standing Order 284 is in breach of the standing orders of this House. Because of that failure it is appropriate that this House sit next week. As of today 17 Government bills are listed for debate on the notice paper. Debate on the second reading of the Appropriation Bill also has to be completed. Last night and this morning we had extensive debate on that bill. If the House does not sit on the days I have proposed, honourable members will not be able to discuss adequately that bill and other bills listed on the notice paper.

My motion calls for an additional three sitting days next week to assist the Government to avoid the traditional end-of-session rush and log jam of legislation. I have no doubt that the Government would wish to avoid that situation. My motion will provide the Government with such an opportunity. In addition to government matters on the notice paper there are 16 non-government bills and in excess of 25 private members' motions, some of which were given notice of today. Clearly, we will not get through that program in the time frame available to us. I know that the Minister for Police and Leader of the House will argue that we cannot sit next week because Ministers have to attend estimates committees. If the Minister opposes this motion I ask him, first, to make a categorical statement to this House that every Minister will be attending estimates committees next week.

The second aspect is that the Legislative Council moved a motion to hold estimates committee hearings. This House has not yet moved a motion to comply with the standing orders that state explicitly that estimates committee hearings shall be appointed. The Leader of the House said that at some later stage an estimates session will be held as a Committee of the Whole. That does not comply with Standing Order 284, which refers explicitly to the establishment of estimates committees. How convenient this decision is. When the Leader of the House sat in opposition he was all for accountability of Ministers. He pushed it down the throats of coalition members every day. He said it was important for the Opposition to question Ministers about the functions of their portfolios.

How things have changed now that the Labor Party is in office and he is a Minister! He often tells the House that this was not something that was the quirk of the last Parliament; it was a genuine attempt by all parties to turn around some of the basic traditions that had continued since the year dot when Executive Government rode roughshod over the Parliament. Parties of all political persuasions were guilty of that. However, the last Parliament overturned that tradition. I would have hoped, and I believe other honourable members would have hoped, that it had been changed forever. Sadly, it has not. After all the pious words in opposition, the Labor Party now fails to honour the people of this State. The Labor Party also fails to honour those honourable members on the crossbenches who worked faithfully with them during the last Parliament. The coalition Government was certainly put under much pressure by the Labor Party, which said to the crossbench members that accountability was a marvellous thing. Those crossbench members have now been duped.

I say to the Government that if during its term it fails to get the numbers by one, and the support of the Independents is needed, it may well rue the day that the decision was made to change these procedures so quickly. The estimates committee hearings ensure the Parliament has control, accountability and the ability to question the Executive Government. Honourable members must remember that the estimates committees established by the Legislative Council do not provide for the participation of honourable members of the Legislative Assembly. Honourable members of this House cannot attend those committee hearings to ask questions. This motion provides the opportunity for honourable members in this House to hold estimates committee hearings, which right will not be given away without a fight.

Mr Whelan: You hypocrite!

Mr WEST: You are the hypocrite! You stood here and said to the honourable member for Bligh, to the honourable member for Manly and to the honourable member for South Coast: This is a marvellous thing. We will back you. We have signed the charter of reform.

Mr Whelan: On estimates?

Mr WEST: On estimates and everything else.

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Mr Whelan: We will have estimates.

Mr WEST: Will estimates hearings be held by the Legislative Assembly next week? If the Legislative Assembly does not hold estimates committee hearings next week, the House should sit, as the motion says, to carry out the important principle of accountability for the benefit of Opposition members and backbench members of the Government. The Opposition is well aware how upset Government backbench members are. Is the Labor Party holding an extra caucus meeting tomorrow? The standing rules prevent my quoting newspapers, but the Sydney morning papers certainly make interesting reading about the problems of the Government. Ministers are riding roughshod over backbench members, who should be given the opportunity to question Ministers about the Government's behaviour. The House could not consider a more important motion than this. Clearly, honourable members will not have the opportunity to participate in estimates committee hearings, as had been programmed.

The Leader of the House circulated a temporary schedule providing dates and times for estimates committees. That temporary schedule has been abandoned for honourable members of this House, who are now denied the opportunity to take part in estimates committees. Rather than turning back the clock and facing a log jam of legislation at the end of a session, I urge all honourable members, particularly those from the Hunter and electorates over the dividing range, who are concerned about changes to Pacific Power, to stand up and be counted. Those honourable members should say to Ministers, "Here is your opportunity for accountability not just within caucus but by publicly demonstrating to your constituents that you have courage and are prepared to earn their support." That procedure can be adopted if honourable members agree to attend this House next week on a three-day normal sitting basis to debate the budget and deal with the backlog of bills. After that the House can find out when estimates hearings will be held as required by the standing orders.

Dr MACDONALD (Manly) [5.36]: This is a dark hour for the Parliament of New South Wales. I support the motion of the honourable member for Orange. I shall also address the abandonment by this Government of the principles of the charter of reform and the Government's broken promises. The charter of reform, to which Labor Party members were signatories, says:

The New South Wales Government, having considered the submission from the Independent Members, accepts that over the 135 years since the advent of responsible Government in New South Wales in 1856, the balance of power between the Parliament and the Executive Government has shifted unduly in favour of the Executive Government.

This attempt to escape proper scrutiny is a shift of power back to the Executive Government. The charter of reform at page 5 in paragraph I clearly makes the following statement:

Estimates Committees for the Parliament in accordance with current Sessional Orders.

I also draw the attention of honourable members to a letter dated 1 July 1991 from the then Leader of the Opposition. In that document he clearly indicated his unqualified support for the charter of reform and spoke about the importance of open and accountable government. That document, which he signed, states under the heading "Parliamentary Committees New Committees":

BUDGET ESTIMATES COMMITTEE. Support Parliamentary Estimates Committee which should be in place in time for 1991 Budget.

The Labor Party waxed lyrical when it was in opposition, but now the attitude is changed. We are experiencing an abandonment of the democratic process in this House in a number of areas. The procedure for consideration of urgent motions is being abused daily by the Government as it uses the numbers to bring on debate about totally non-urgent matters. Day after day the contest on urgency is uneven as the Government uses its numbers. Today the Government used another initiative to essentially erode the benefits of private members' morning when a somewhat spurious notice of motion by the honourable member for Bulli was given preference over another 22 notices of motions to enable its debate to commence at 11.30. Consequently this pushed another matter off the agenda. It is a shame this Government takes this procedure. Members of this House are required to abide by a set of printed rules called the Standing Rules and Orders. Standing Order 284(1) provides:

During second reading debate on the Appropriation Bill on motion of a Minister, the House shall appoint Estimates Committees.

The Leader of the House is not complying with that standing order. Next week four full days of estimates committee hearings have been abandoned. The motion of the Legislative Council has been used as an excuse to abandon those committees. It is a grab for power by the Legislative Council. It is somewhat ironic in that the Legislative Council cannot amend appropriation legislation. Therefore, the only parliamentarians who can amend appropriation legislation - members of the Legislative Assembly - will be excluded from participating in that committee process. Because I will not have an opportunity to play a proper role in estimates committees, I am of a mind to vote against this budget. Members of the Opposition should give consideration to voting against it also because they are being disenfranchised. I hope one of the Government members is absent from the House when the motion is voted on; it will bring the Government down.

The decision to abandon estimates committees is a stupid one. The Democrats argued in the upper House that they saw the role of the committees as similar to that of the Senate committees. The Senate is different from the Legislative Council because the Legislative Council cannot vote on the Appropriation Bill, it can only move notations. Estimates committees may be a clumsy attempt to try to reach into the appropriation process, but they should not be abandoned on the excuse that the
Page 2364
Legislative Council has designed its own version of committee. The Auditor-General in his paper entitled "The Challenge of Change - Public Sector Auditing", which stated that estimates committees could be improved, said:

The reach of questions that can be asked by members of Estimates Committees seems exceedingly narrow. Under some interpretations, questions cannot relate to achievements met by the most recent year's expenditures. Moreover, only budget entities are subject to Estimates Committees which means that bodies such as the Audit Office which receives no direct budget appropriations (but which is entirely dependent on Government funds) escapes scrutiny.

The Leader of the Democrats in the upper House, the Hon. Elisabeth Kirkby, made some relevant comments. She talked about the opportunity to get access to the off-budget sector, the statutory authorities. The idea of estimates being divided into portfolio areas is also a good one. The estimates process should not be abandoned, it should be improved. Let us have joint committees. Let us not disenfranchise the members of the lower House. The Legislative Assembly should be put first. The next three weeks provides us with adequate time to play a roll in consideration of the estimates. The Leader of the House has said to me, "Don't worry, on 15 and 22 November, on Wednesday nights, we will have a few hours of estimates consideration." That is not acceptable. It is not in the spirit of the charter of reform. It is not in the spirit of Labor Party promises when it was in opposition. It does nothing to provide accountability and scrutiny. The Leader of the House has also suggested that members will have an opportunity to participate in the Committee of the Whole; but we will not have the detailed access to Ministers and their support staff that we want. We should be enhancing the role of the committee process, not abandoning it. It is a dark hour for the House.

Ms MOORE (Bligh) [5.43]: I wholeheartedly support the motion, and the comments of the honourable member for Manly that this is a dark hour for this House. I had hoped that after the experience of the Fiftieth Parliament, the opening up of the democratic process and the processes of accountability - that had the full support of the then Opposition - we would not experience such regression so quickly. We are into the twenty-fifth day of the tenth month of this year, yet this Parliament has sat for only 20 days. Last night I heard a most extraordinary comment: honourable members of the upper House have been told that they cannot sit because it is too expensive. It is too expensive to have a sitting day! If that is the pressure under which honourable members of the upper House are operating, the whole process is a farce.

As the honourable member for Orange has pointed out, although there are 23 private members' notices of motion, a number of private members' bills and a good deal of legislation on the business paper, this House will not sit next week because the Government has agreed to abandon joint estimates committees, allowed members of the law-making body of this Parliament, the Legislative Assembly, to meet with members of the Legislative Council to question Ministers about their allocations. They gave all members of Parliament across the political spectrum an opportunity to cross-examine Ministers and bureaucrats on budget allocations. I recall members of the former Opposition, some of whom are now members of this Government, saying to me when the joint estimates committees process was introduced, "What a fantastic mechanism this is. This is something really good that has come out of the Fiftieth Parliament. It is marvellous that we can cross-examine Ministers about their allocations."

That at least one Minister attended an estimates committee with 18 bureaucrats is evidence that the process put Ministers under real pressure; they were accountable for what they were doing with taxpayers' money. The establishment of estimates committees was a vital reform of the Fiftieth Parliament. As the honourable member for Manly said, the Leader of the Opposition at the time - the present Premier - agreed most enthusiastically to the proposal. I recall that at the time, with great fanfare, he invited the non-aligned Independents to his room. All the television cameras were there, we signed the agreement, and he made public statements about how important it was to maintain public accountability, how important it was to have participation, and how he would embrace these reforms when he became Premier. What a sorry state we have reached.

This year we have sat on only 20 days. Private members' notices of motions were today made a mockery of by the honourable member for Bulli, with the concurrence of the Speaker and the Government. The Minister for Small Business and Regional Development today made a mockery of question time. I would like new honourable members on both sides of the House to understand that before the Fiftieth Parliament and the charter of reform we did not have a viable question time in this Parliament. I am led to believe - although I was not a member of this place in those days - that Premier Barrie Unsworth was the past master of the 40-minute answer. He was able to take up all the time for questions by responding to only one question. I experienced his being a master at the two-hour debate. Question time is not only a time when Ministers receive dorothy dix questions, answers prepared by their departments for them to read; it is a time when Ministers can show how they are enjoying their portfolios, that they are right on top of their responsibilities and are happy to answer questions. That is why question time should be vigorous and why we should be sitting next week. I recall the Leader of the House when he was the leader of the previous Labor Opposition saying to me nearly every day, "You know, Clover, what we have to do is have more sitting days."

Mr Whelan: Did you ever agree?

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Ms MOORE: I do agree. I do believe that we should sit. The people of New South Wales have elected us. I am the monitor for sitting hours, honourable members know that.

Mr Whelan: You want to sit, but you don't want to sit.

Ms MOORE: I do not mind being the self-appointed representative of the families of members of this Parliament to ensure that we do not sit all night, as John Dowd used to have us do - 30 hours straight on one particular occasion! It was legislation by exhaustion. It was so badly managed, it was a nightmare. We all felt exhausted. There was no logical or well-reasoned debate because members were asleep in their rooms because we were sitting until two, three, four and five o'clock in the morning. I will fight that while ever I have breath in me. The Minister is trying to turn the clock back to the dark old days. Following those reforms this Parliament was described as the most progressive in the Westminster system, with true accountability and participation, and backbenchers on both sides were able to move motions or bring legislation forward to be debated and voted on. Backbenchers were able to ask questions. The Leader of the House knows that question time was extended not so that the Opposition could ask only five questions, as happened during the question time farce today. What a nonsense.

We extended question time so that 10 questions, not five, could be asked by members; if members had not managed to ask 10 questions by the end of the 45-minute question time, the period was extended. That provision is such an important part of the charter of reform, which is all about participation and accountability and the democratic processes. If this House is not going to sit next week, and if we are not to have estimates committees, I cannot but help ask the Premier, and the Government, what they have to hide. Why will they not allow urgency? The Leader of the House knows that he was the one who put the proposal to the Independents - who took it to the Government of the day - that we must have urgency to allow Opposition members and the Independents to raise very urgent matters that they would not otherwise have an opportunity to bring before the House.

Motion for the suspension of standing and sessional orders, by leave, by Mr Whelan agreed to:

That standing and sessional orders be suspended to allow Business with Precedence Notice of Motion No. 1 to be concluded before the taking of Private Members' Statements and for the sitting to be extended for this business, with members not being permitted to call a division on any question or call attention to the want of a quorum after Private Members' Statements have commenced.

Ms MOORE: If question time is to be abused, as happened today, and if urgency is to be abused, as we have seen every sitting day, and if private members' notices of motion are to be abused, as we again saw today, we must ask what the Government has got to hide. Why does the Premier and Ministers not answer questions other than their own dorothy dixers? Why will they not allow urgency and have debate, for example, about the Sydney showground? I have received no answers to that question. Two proposals for urgency have not been agreed to, yet the Leader of the House was the very one who put the proposal to the Independents. We took the proposal to the government of the day to allow non-government members a window of opportunity to bring forward an urgent or important matter that they would not otherwise have had the opportunity to discuss. We have been abused by Ministers, who can make ministerial statements, who can give dorothy-dix answers to questions, and who at any time can suspend standing and sessional orders to put matters of importance before the House. The Government is denying this opportunity to half the members of this House. The Government has only a majority of one. One by-election could change that.

Mr Gibson: Not one by-election - two.

Ms MOORE: For the moment. Let us just consider -

Mr Whelan: Consider the motion.

Ms MOORE: I am considering the motion in the light of circumstances. We all know that in a political situation circumstances can change. I assure the Leader of the House that I will fight hard to maintain these reforms as I fought to get them in the first place. I want to put on the public record my strongest personal disappointment in the Leader of the House and the Premier, because they were both deeply involved in that process. We met with them week in and week out. They gave the strongest possible commitments in this House and in all those meeting rooms that they were totally committed to accountability, reforms and participation. The Minister has turned the clock back. It is a regression.

Mr Jeffery: You did believe them, did you?

Ms MOORE: Yes. I do happen to believe in people and in commitments publicly given.

Mr Whelan: So do I.

Ms MOORE: I would like to see you carrying out those commitments. In these pathetic 20 sitting days we have seen an appalling attack on the Auditor-General. What a marvellous contribution the Auditor-General made to the Fiftieth Parliament and is continuing to make to this Fifty-first Parliament. He is the public servant accountable to the people of New South Wales to ensure accountability and probity. I strongly support his Luna Park report, what he did with the Roads and Traffic Authority, and indeed what I hope he will do with the showground. It is extraordinary that the Government has not only tried to turn the clock back on question time, notices of urgent motions, and private members' day, but also that it has attacked the Director of Public Prosecutions and the Auditor-General.

Page 2366

Mr Jeffery: The Ombudsman will be next.

Ms MOORE: It will be the Ombudsman. We will see the winding down of the Independent Commission Against Corruption, which has made such a real difference to probity and accountability, particularly in the public service. It is so sad that on the twentieth sitting day of the Fifty-first Parliament we are debating the winding back of the clock on participation and accountability. I strongly support the motion. I call on the Government to reinstate the estimates committees so that members of the Legislative Assembly, the law-making Chamber, will be able to cross-examine and question Ministers and their bureaucrats. We will not have that opportunity, I understand, next week. I would be delighted to hear the Minister say that indeed we are having estimates committees in which we could all participate.

Mr Whelan: Not even this very successful Government could have Ministers in two places at once.

Ms MOORE: We have all had a taste of democracy. I do not think the Minister will be able to turn the clock back or get away with having us sit until 3 or 4 a.m. Members have tasted something different.

Mr Whelan: Has that happened in the last six months?

Ms MOORE: No, it has not, and we are watching to make sure it does not happen. You did try to do it - and we have sat for only 20 days. If we do not sit next week, given that we have sat so few days, what will happen at Christmas? Will we be sitting right up to that point?

Mr Whelan: Yes, we will.

Ms MOORE: I do not mind sitting extra days. We have been elected to this Parliament. One of our prime functions is to debate and vote on legislation. I do not believe that the people of New South Wales want us to be in this Chamber at 3 a.m. The people of New South Wales would like half the Parliament to be made up of women. Most women have family responsibilities. We hear all this cant from the Government about how it wants women to participate in the Parliament, but it does not get down to the practicalities of allowing women to go home to their baby sitters or to finish at hours that women feel comfortable with - and that is not at three o'clock in the morning! These are important issues. We will fight hard to ensure a continuation of a democratic participatory Parliament, not a return to the Parliament of the 1980s. I call upon the Leader of the House to reinstate the estimates committees. I call on him not to allow his Ministers to abuse question time or urgency. I also call on him to allow all members of the Parliament to participate, just as in opposition he appreciated the Independents allowing him to participate actively so that he could make a real contribution in the Fiftieth Parliament.

Mr WHELAN (Ashfield - Minister for Police) [5.59]: I have a degree of sympathy for the two Independent members who have spoken in this debate, but I have absolutely none for Opposition members on this matter. The Government finds itself in the following position. The legislative agenda, namely the estimates committees, has been the subject of a deliberate hijack by members of the minor parties in the Legislative Council. They have conspired, with the consent of the National Party and the Liberal Party, to have established estimates committees of the Legislative Council. I know that because I met with the seven crossbench members of the Legislative Council and I asked them if they had the numbers. The answer was yes, because they had the support of the Liberal Party and the National Party. The Treasurer, who was also present, said they were guilty of hijacking.

The Liberal Party and the National Party made a deliberate decision to remove the right of the Legislative Assembly to have coordinated estimates committees, as had been foreshadowed. I ask honourable members to look at the schedule of proposed sitting dates that I distributed. That schedule shows estimates committees for the Legislative Assembly on Monday, 30 October; Tuesday, 31 October; Wednesday, 1 November; and Thursday, 2 November. It also shows Private Members' Statements on Thursday, 16 November, followed by the Committee of the Whole. The Government had every intention of following that schedule, until the conspiracy between the crossbench members of the upper House and those with whom the honourable member for Bligh intends to vote.

Ms Moore: What are you going to do about it?

Mr WHELAN: I will tell you in a minute. The honourable member for Gosford had some interesting things to say about the role of the Legislative Assembly. He said:

The Parliament is based upon the Westminster system, and the primary focus of the power of this House lies in the control of the budgetary process . . . The Legislative Assembly is the focus of this Parliament and the basis of its powers is money bills and finance.

The honourable member continued:

The Legislative Assembly controls the Government; the Government is accountable to the Legislative Assembly. The function of government is to handle the finances, to manage the assets and to provide the services of the State, including the public service.

Members of the Liberal Party know full well that in their joint conspiracy with crossbenchers from the upper House they have hijacked the budgetary process for the first time since 1856. They agreed with the Hon. Elisabeth Kirkby. Members with whom the honourable member for Bligh is going to vote agreed that they would have sole prerogative in relation to the budget estimates. Thank goodness for Reverend the Hon. F. J. Nile. At least he realised there were constitutional requirements in
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relation to the return of the budget. He also drew attention to the lack of probity, in that the Legislative Council had no rights in the financial processes of government. Thank heavens he realised there was a problem, otherwise it would have been forced down out throats.

The motion seeks that this House should sit on Tuesday, 31 October; Wednesday, 1 November; and Thursday, 2 November. The notice paper states that the upper House wants the Minister for Police; the Minister for Mineral Resources, and Minister for Fisheries; the Premier; the Minister for Small Business and Regional Development; the Minister for Sport and Recreation; the Minister for Public Works and Services; the Minister for Urban Affairs and Planning; the Minister for Gaming and Racing; the Minister for the Environment; the Minister for Education and Training; the Minister for Corrective Services; and the Minister for Agriculture to appear at upper House estimates committees at the same time that the honourable member for Ermington has proposed that this House should sit.

I know that Ministers are good, but they cannot be in two places at once. My primary role is to be in this House. Is it suggested that the Premier should appear before a Legislative Council estimates committee instead of being present in this Chamber for question time? If that happened, press releases would be issued stating that the Premier is not interested. This motion is based on hypocrisy and on a hijacked agenda. Ministers will answer questions at Legislative Council estimates committees and arrangements have been made in relation to compliance - but not compliance by the Legislative Assembly with anything that the Legislative Council asks. Government Ministers have been placed in a position in which they could be accused of not being accountable to the Legislative Council if they do not attend.

Dr Macdonald: You are certainly not being accountable to the lower House.

Mr WHELAN: I will come to that position, because I believe it is redeemable. Ministers have to attend the estimates committees of the Legislative Council on 31 October, and on 1 and 2 November. The Ministers I have named will be there. Other Ministers will attend on other days. The Government has also agreed to have statutory bodies included in the budgetary process. Independent members opposite wanted that provision, and it has been included in the charter of reform. The honourable member for Bligh is going to vote with these hypocrites - the same people who offered her the poisoned chalice.

When negotiations were held I asked the Hon. Elisabeth Kirkby if she had discussed the matter with Independent members of the lower House, and her answer was no. I said that Independent members would be distressed because this hijacking would deny all members of the Legislative Assembly their rightful position in the budgetary process and would destroy any opportunity for them to be involved in the joint estimates committees. The system of joint estimates committees was flawed, it was not perfect. However, it was a joint approach and it worked well. This proposal was the result of a power-hungry grab by minor parties in the upper House in collusion with the Liberal and National parties.

Ms Moore: You have colluded, too.

Mr WHELAN: I have not colluded. I cannot be in two places at once. It is not possible for me to appear as Minister for Police in the Legislative Council to answer questions and to be in this Chamber as a member of the Legislative Assembly. The Opposition has set the timetable. The Leader of the Opposition in the upper House has moved a motion that lower House bills will not be dealt with automatically for five days and Legislative Council bills will not be dealt with for 10 days. Talk about hijacking government programs! The honourable member for Bligh said we need more sitting days. She will have more sitting days because we will be sitting until at least Thursday, 14 December.

Ms Moore: How many days will that be for the year?

Mr WHELAN: This is an election year. The Parliament did not resume until June because of the election.

Ms Moore: In March.

Mr WHELAN: Yes, and there are certain constitutional requirements that have to be complied with. Perhaps the honourable member for Bligh can be reminded of the statutory requirements of 40 days for the return of writs, members being sworn in and other provisions of the Parliamentary Electorates and Elections Act. She will then realise that it was not possible for Parliament to resume until June. This will be the first time sittings of the Parliament have continued so close to Christmas, and that is exactly what the Government will do. As for a conversation that I had with the honourable member for Manly, it is true that I told him - and I will honour this commitment - that the Government has contemplated sitting additional nights for the purpose of additional budgetary processes. I am keen to enable as many honourable members as possible to make speeches in the budget debate. However, debates such as those that have taken place today obviously call into doubt my expressed desire.

We will sit additional hours. This is not a matter that I can agree to without consultation. The program shows that we will sit on Wednesday, 15 November, Thursday, 16 November, Wednesday, 22 November, Thursday, 23 November and perhaps Friday, 24 November, for the purposes of completing the estimates process and debate in Committee of the Whole House. The Government's priority, which members opposite know only too well but are trying to frustrate, is to ensure that the
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budget process finishes by the last week in November, and we will do that. Until then, there will be additional time in which honourable members will be involved in the budgetary process either by way of budget speeches or in the Committee of the Whole House.

Mr Macdonald: Not the estimates committees?

Mr WHELAN: You cannot have estimates committees. We will not waste money having estimates committees when we have an estimates committee of which honourable members opposite are members. Opposition members have forced this on the lower House. The only good news is that next year the Government's budgetary process will occur in May. I hope that Independent members opposite will tell crossbenchers in the upper House that what they have done is outrageous. We are also willing to make the estimates process, the joint House estimates process, meaningful. We want the process to provide greater accountability. Honourable members are aware of the farce of the previous process; it was an absolute joke.

Ms Moore: It could be improved.

Mr WHELAN: Of course it could be improved, and we will improve it by providing greater accountability. When we were in opposition we wanted to have statutory authorities. We have agreed that that will happen, and we are happy for it to happen. For argument's sake, the process could be improved by changing the period for questions and restricting the number of questions and the number of answers given; and allowing more questions on notice and more time for questions on notice. We could use some of the examples of the Senate estimates committees. The Senate is not perfect, but its estimates committees operate better than ours. The motion moved by the honourable member for Orange is framed in hypocrisy. He was probably part of the process. The House will sit on more days, until 14 December. I give an undertaking that there will be additional sitting days, and I shall notify honourable members of the dates. I can indicate that the Parliament will sit late on Wednesday, 15 November, and Wednesday, 22 November. That is advance notice. However, I would not put those dates in the diary just yet.

Ms Moore: It's anti-family.

Mr WHELAN: There is a terrible contradiction; you want to sit longer and on more days. Would you like to sit on 19, 20 and 21 December? You talk about family friendly hours. When do parents have to be at home? Parents must be at home more than ever during school holidays. Members opposite are saying that the Parliament should sit through the whole school holiday program. They can have family friendly hours, but if the House sits during the school holidays they will have no family left. It is a ridiculous suggestion. The Parliament will sit longer to get through the budgetary program.

The honourable member for Orange mentioned that the Government has 17 outstanding bills. I can assure him that the Government has every confidence that those bills will pass through the Parliament. The bills will be debated in the Chamber, and we will have a full and frank discussion on the Government's legislative program. There will be additional sitting times, and I will notify honourable members of them. I have indicated that Wednesdays and Thursdays will be late nights and, indeed, we may have to sit on some Fridays as well. We are determined that honourable members will have an opportunity to examine the budgetary process in a meaningful way. I hope that honourable members will see their way to reject the motion, which is framed in hypocrisy.

Mr ROZZOLI (Hawkesbury) [6.15]: The Leader of the House has just treated honourable members to a diatribe in which he used the word hypocrisy on a number of occasions. If ever there was an exercise in hypocrisy, it came from the other side of the House in the contribution from the Leader of the House. The motion is simple. It will commit this House to sit on three days next week for the carriage of business, and it will allow the House to determine what it does during those sitting hours. The business to be dealt with could include debate on the functioning of estimates committees and carriage of the Parliament's business in terms of bills and general notices of motion or question time - or it could preclude those things. All this motion states is that the House should commit itself to sitting between certain times on three days, 31 October and 1 and 2 November.

The Minister for Police spoke about a deliberate conspiracy on the part of Opposition members and members of minority parties in the upper House. There may be an agreement between those members to implement a strategy, which emerged in the way that it did, to have estimates committees confined to the upper House. However, there is absolutely no reason that this House, a sovereign Parliament, must agree with any such decision that comes from the upper House. When a message comes from the upper House requesting that Ministers cooperate by appearing before upper House only committees, all we have to say is that we do not agree with the request; if the upper House wants to have estimates committees, and if it wants Ministers to attend those committees, we must have joint committees. We would then suggest a program and ask the Legislative Council to concur with our request for joint committees on this basis. We will then agree to have Ministers from the Legislative Assembly attend those joint committees.

The upper House can make whatever decisions it wants under its sovereignty. But there is no constitutional power that dictates the wishes of that House on the conventions of the Legislative Assembly. Undoubtedly, what motivated Opposition members and members of the minority parties in the upper House was that they suspected,
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probably correctly, that if they did not have estimates committees there would be no estimates committees at all. The releasing of a piece of paper by the Leader of the House stating that we will have estimates committees on certain days was an exercise in brinkmanship, and will not result in there being joint estimates committees.

Since the budget was delivered in the first week of this section of sittings in September the Minister for Police has had the opportunity to put a motion before the House detailing the provisions for joint estimates committees. To this stage, nearing the end of October, no such motion has appeared. There is nothing to stop the introduction of such a motion, irrespective of any resolution of the Legislative Council. The clear indication that that gives to members of the Opposition and the minority parties and Independents in both Houses is that this Government did not intend to have estimates committees in accordance with the intention of the standing orders of this House. If the second reading debate on the Appropriation Bill and cognate bills is terminated without resolving the question relating to the establishment of estimates committees, this Government will be in breach of the standing orders.

The Government, for whatever reason - and I would not even start to think what it might be - wishes to avoid scrutiny of the Appropriation Bill by members of the Legislative Assembly within a committee process. The Minister for Police contradicted himself in his contribution to this debate by saying that although the previous estimates committees were not perfect they worked well. Later in his debate he said they did not work very well at all, they were useless, the whole system was a farce and was not worth the time expended on the estimates committees and the Government was going to dream up some you-beaut system next year which would correct these problems. We do not have any more faith in his protestations about the intention for next year than we have any faith in his intention to allow us to debate the estimates in committees on this occasion.

I am sure the honourable member for Orange will concur that if we had a Hansard transcript of the meetings of the Standing Orders Committee when it discussed the creation of estimates committees it would show the full flow of pious utterances from the Minister for Police, the Deputy Leader of the Opposition as he then was, and the current Minister for Education and Training. The Minister for Education and Training with extraordinary eloquence argued the importance of those opportunities being made available to the Opposition. He argued about time factors, the number of questions, the duration of answers and said repeatedly how important and fundamental to the democratic process these estimates committees were. The Minister for Police trivialised the whole matter in his contribution to the debate.

The Minister for Police spoke about the need for extra sitting days, extended sitting times in the evening to get a proper budget debate and a proper estimates committee, presumably in the Committee of the Whole House, and to get through the various bills and motions which are on the business paper. The honourable member neglected to tell the House that the only reason the Government is in this parlous situation of having to contemplate extra sitting days and extended hours is because it has frittered away week after week of potential sitting days earlier in the year. Only one other honourable member has been a member of this House for longer than I have. We have sat through exactly the same number of sessions.

Mr McBride: Name him!

Mr ROZZOLI: The Minister for Gaming and Racing, and Minister Assisting the Premier on Hunter Development is one of a very select group of members who have been here for a considerable period. It includes also the honourable member for Orange, the honourable member for East Hills, that wise and erudite member of the Government and me. No matter what the circumstances regarding elections - whether they were held at the beginning or the end of the year - never has there been a budget session start so late, start so limply and be so inadequately addressed. That is an absolute indictment of the incompetence and mismanagement of the Leader of the House, who must bear the responsibility because of his position, and of the whole of the Government: the Premier and the members of Cabinet because they combine to draft the program for government. It is the Government that drives the sitting days of any Parliament because it sets the legislative program.

It is of no use the Minister for Police saying at this stage that there is a shortness of time, that we will have to sit extra days, or that we might have to sit between Christmas and New Year. The only reason for the Government being in that situation is its total incompetence in setting a proper parliamentary program. The Leader of the House gave as reasons the fact that the election had been held on 25 March and there were certain statutory times for returns of writs and all that sort of thing. The House could have commenced to sit at the end of April or early May and could have sat every day between then and now. There is absolutely no statutory bar on the sittings of the House. The sittings could have been organised whenever the Government wanted to organise them. The Government has chosen not to have this House sit on very many days this year. It has already demonstrated its desire to gag legislation and to block probing debate. The Government stands indicted and should not have the confidence of the people of New South Wales that it is competent to govern.

Mr WEST (Orange) [6.26], in reply: I thank the honourable member for Hawkesbury in particular for his contribution. Because of the
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length of his service in this House he clearly does have a memory of events going back over a very long period of time and, in particular, is able to assess the changes that have occurred through various governments. He has made some telling points. The honourable member for Manly and the honourable member for Bligh have also indicated to this House very lucidly that they feel they were conned, having sat through the last Parliament, by what could only be described as the collusion of the then Leader of the Opposition and the honourable member for Ashfield, who is now the Leader of the House, in setting up these processes for which they were enthusiastic, but which now are to be dumped. If the Leader of the House were sincere he would admit to the House that the Government has something else it must do before this motion is decided.

Last evening a message was reported to the House from the Legislative Council for the first time formally advising that the Legislative Council would hold its estimates committees and informing us of the membership of those estimates committees. The times of the hearings of the committees are now a matter of public knowledge. The honourable member for Ashfield should be saying that the Legislative Assembly intends to send a message back to the Legislative Council advising that this House does not accept the message, but insists on there being joint estimates committees. It is ludicrous for the Leader of the House to suggest that my colleagues on this side of the House and I have colluded with the Independents in the upper House. He is in collusion because he has failed to put before the House a motion that insists on maintaining the rights of the Legislative Assembly. That is the Minister's very simple, basic failure. The Leader of the House also said that he could not be in two places at once. If the Leader of the House and the Government do not insist on joint estimates committees the Minister for Police will be scheduled to attend an estimates committee on Tuesday next week between the hours of 9.30 a.m. and 12 noon, so he would be able to be in this House for question time on that day.

Mr Gibson: He would miss caucus.

Mr WEST: He would miss caucus anyway. At the moment the Government needs every member it can get in caucus. On each of the three days I propose that this House should sit only two Ministers would be absent and not available for question time. I accept that on Tuesday, 31 October, the Premier will be absent. The Premier should not be absent during question time. It would be easy to reschedule estimates committee sittings and substitute the estimates committee dealing with the Department for Mineral Resources and Fisheries with the estimate committee dealing with the Premier's Department. I am sure that the Minister for Mineral Resources, and Minister for Fisheries would not mind missing question time; he would be happy to be out of this Chamber.

If we followed that simple procedure it would solve the problem on that day, thus enabling this House to sit. We could debate the Appropriation Bill and get through some of the other bills listed on the notice paper. Ministers involved in estimates committees could, in fact, do both. It would be a simple administrative procedure, if only Government members applied their minds to it. The Leader of the House, in response to the honourable member for Bligh, said, "When have we had late night sittings under my leadership? It has never happened." Let us have a look at the record. There was one occasion. On 8 June we sat until 2.15 a.m.

Mr McManus: And who caused it?

Mr WEST: It does not matter who caused it. The Leader of the House, who made that statement, signalled that the sittings of this House would be extended on a number of days. Those honourable members who have made commitments to their families will not be able to honour those commitments. We heard earlier from the honourable member for Bligh how difficult it is for honourable members to make decisions and worthwhile contributions at a late hour of the night. The Minister for Police is not coping adequately with his responsibilities. He has failed. If he were fair dinkum he would say, "Let us send a message to the Legislative Council stating that we do not accept its proposal."

[Interruption]

That motion was not moved by the Opposition. If you send a message of that nature to the Legislative Council we will vote for it.

Mr SPEAKER: Order! The honourable member for Orange will address his remarks through the Chair.

Mr WEST: I have a very real concern. The Leader of the House said he will give us time to debate matters in Committee, which will comply with Standing Order 283, but he has not explained how that will prevent us from breaching Standing Order 284. Standing Order 284 states that, after second reading debate on the Appropriation Bill, this House must have estimates committees. If the Minister for Police does not suspend that standing order before the conclusion of the second reading debate he will be in breach of it. I do not want that to happen. Clearly, the Minister for Police is in a position to move a motion to enable this House to appoint joint estimates committees. He should come into this House and say, "We will go to the Legislative Council and insist on joint estimates committees." Even if he does not do that he should support my motion because, on the three days to which I have referred, only two Ministers will be absent during question time.

It is standard procedure for other Ministers to answer questions on behalf of those who are absent. Yesterday the Minister for Police was unable to be in the House during question time because the Lieutenant Governor was in his electorate. The Premier said that, during his absence, he would
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answer questions directed to the Minister for Police. The way in which this House is being administered at the moment amounts to a farce. This House needs additional sitting days to debate the matters to which I have referred. My motion provides for those additional sitting days. The Leader of the House, who said that this Government should be more accountable, should put his money where his mouth is. I urge all honourable members to support my motion.

Question - That the motion be agreed to - put.

The House divided.

Mr Armstrong Mr O'Farrell
Mr Blackmore Mr D. L. Page
Mr Causley Mr Peacocke
Mr Chappell Mr Phillips
Mr Cochran Mr Photios
Mr Collins Mr Richardson
Mr Cruickshank Mr Rixon
Mr Downy Mr Rozzoli
Mr Ellis Mr Schipp
Mr Fahey Mr Schultz
Ms Ficarra Mrs Skinner
Mr Fraser Mr Slack-Smith
Mr Glachan Mr Small
Mr Hartcher Mr Smith
Mr Hazzard Mr Souris
Mr Humpherson Mr Tink
Mr Kinross Mr Turner
Mr Longley Mr West
Dr Macdonald Mr Zammit
Ms Machin
Mr Merton Tellers,
Ms Moore Mr Jeffery
Mr O'Doherty Mr Kerr

Ms Allan Mr Martin
Mr Amery Ms Meagher
Mr Anderson Mr Mills
Ms Andrews Mr Moss
Mrs Beamer Mr Nagle
Mr Clough Mr Neilly
Mr Crittenden Ms Nori
Mr Face Mr E. T. Page
Mr Gaudry Mr Price
Mr Gibson Mr Rogan
Mrs Grusovin Mr Rumble
Ms Hall Mr Scully
Mr Harrison Mr Shedden
Ms Harrison Mr Stewart
Mr Hunter Mr Sullivan
Mr Iemma Mr Tripodi
Mr Knight Mr Watkins
Mr Knowles Mr Whelan
Mr Langton Mr Windsor
Mrs Lo Po' Mr Yeadon
Mr Lynch
Mr McBride Tellers,
Mr McManus Mr Beckroge
Mr Markham Mr Thompson

Mr Beck Mr Aquilina
Mrs Chikarovski Mr Carr
Mr Debnam Mr Debus
Dr Kernohan Dr Refshauge

Question so resolved in the negative.

Motion negatived.



Mr SCHULTZ (Burrinjuck) [6.44]: I raise an issue of deep concern for my constituents about the environment and economy of the Tumut and district area. This issue centres around snigging and rocking operations carried out by the Department of Water Resources. The department is undertaking these operations on the Tumut River just up from the caravan park. The process is creating enormous problems in the river. During the operations the river level is lowered to the extent where only 100 megalitres flow from Blowering Dam each day. This effectively brings the river to a standstill. The following day, to ensure the flow of the river, the flow rate from Blowering Dam is increased by 6,800 megalitres. This influx of water washes away enormous sections of the bank, creates turbulence, destroys ecology, and creates massive problems for the tourist trade in the township of Tumut and the surrounding district. The trout season has just commenced and tourists are fishing for trout in the mountain streams. The Tumut River is one of those streams where trophy-type trout are prevalent.

Snigging and rocking operations are proceeding at a time when the Government is pushing the environmental issue throughout New South Wales. Despite that, the Minister responsible for the environmental program is blatantly and irresponsibly allowing the destruction of the ecology of one of our major river resources. Many people believe that the department is breaking the provisions of the Pollution Control Act 1970 and the Clean Waters Act 1970. It is incumbent upon the Minister to ensure that a more sensible and responsible approach is undertaken by the Department of Water Resources to carry out necessary snigging and rocking operations on the Tumut River. However, that does not mean continuing the process that I have described in which the river level is lowered to such an extent that the flow is reduced and increased dramatically each day.

Allowing 6,800 megalitres to flow down the river in this banking-type flow causes massive problems for the river banks. It is a problem for the ecology of the river and the environment and for many land-holders who reside along the river. Land-holders are losing acres of productive land
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each year because of the irresponsible action of the Department of Water Resources in its snigging and rocking operations. When the river level drops to 100 megalitres in a day, it allows access to the small trickle by stock on adjacent properties. When the river level drops many property fences drop into the river. This allows the cattle to get on to the river bed, knocking down more river banks, stirring up the river and compounding the problem. If the Minister for Land and Water Conservation is so vigorously intent on cleaning up the environment of New South Wales, I urge him to get off his backside and tell his department to act responsibly towards the environment and, more importantly, to act against this abuse of the environment at the expense of my constituents and the economic viability of rural towns such as Tumut.


Mr SULLIVAN (Wollongong) [6.49]: I raise the matter of the Lake Illawarra Authority and the use of surrounding foreshore lands. The Lake Illawarra Authority was established in 1987 under a separate statute to take over all decision making that affects Lake Illawarra. Previously a number of government departments had been involved to a greater or lesser extent, which often created nothing more than a stalemate when attempting to solve the major problems facing the lake because of lack of agreement on what should or should not happen and the sequence in which developments should occur. However, since its establishment the lake authority has undertaken a range of activities, one of which will become a matter of increasing concern, and that relates to development on the lake foreshore. Before the establishment of the Lake Illawarra Authority a number of developments had taken place on the lake foreshore around Reddall Parade, Lake South, such as the police boys club and enclosed sporting fields. In other areas approval was given to licensed clubs, sailing clubs and motor boat clubs to construct clubhouses on the edge of the lake. Such developments occurred at Griffins Bay, Warrawong; Reddall Parade; Berkeley; and Kanahooka, a suburb adjoining Dapto.

I want to speak specifically about Griffins Bay and Warrawong, an area at the north-eastern end of the lake adjoining the major shopping centre of Warrawong which is second only to Wollongong as a large commercial centre within the Illawarra district. The foreshore of Griffins Bay has undergone a number of developments, such as the Illawarra Yacht Club Limited and associated structures including a two-storey clubhouse, facilities for a chandler, storage area for trailable yachts and a number of sea containers for storage purposes. A jetty has been constructed on the western side where the vessel Merinda, a floating restaurant, tied up, and an associated car park is located there. Next to the yacht club a $700,000 sea cadet centre is in the process of development. Next to that on the eastern side will be a rowing club costing approximately $400,000. On the southern side of Griffins Bay is residential development to the waters edge and residential development to the west of the Illawarra Yacht Club.

Since the establishment of the Lake Illawarra Authority a major program of dredging and cleaning up of Griffins Bay, which was very shallow and very smelly, has been undertaken. As a result, major foreshore areas have been reclaimed. The area is larger than Wollongong botanic gardens, so it is not a small site, and contains land that has been restored as open parkland. You can drive to the foreshore of the lake, park your car, and walk around the garden areas and the reclaimed area that is now open lawn with beds of shrubs and trees. That area basically faces Northcliffe Drive. The lake authority proposes to develop a major area facing King Street on the eastern end as three, one-hectare sites whereby private developers could lease the land and construct major complexes. There is also one, four-hectare site at the corner of King Street and Northcliffe Drive which will be available for the provision of a hotel-motel-restaurant complex. The three, one-hectare sites proposed by the lake authority will be developed to 70 per cent - [Time expired.]


Mr COCHRAN (Monaro) [6.54]: I speak on behalf of two constituents, Michael and Brett McDonald of Oakvale, Williamsdale, near Canberra, sixth generation Australians, who are in a legal maze that could only be described as horrific. It is the result of a case undertaken by Colin Fisher and Robin Keogh who applied to open a quarry on their property and who have used falsified documentation to place a caveat on the ownership of the McDonald property, thereby denying the owners of the property the right to use it as security to borrow money. The McDonald family claims that the contract to place the caveat over the property was fraudulently put together by the applicants, and that the applicants - Fisher and Keogh - are being investigated for fraud by Queanbeyan police. Investigations that both I and the McDonalds have conducted reveal that Robin Keogh has a record of outstanding debts in the Queanbeyan area. I have letters from various business houses that have a record of his debts and little faith in Mr Keogh's repaying those debts.

The McDonalds have challenged the caveat in the Supreme Court and are defending themselves. They do not have sufficient funds to hire legal representation and they have not been able to secure legal representation, as the legal community knows that funds could not be recouped from either Robin Keogh or Colin Fisher if the court action were successful. The applicants, Fisher and Keogh, have instituted further proceedings against the McDonalds, suing them for $10 million for loss of trade and loss of profit on the quarry. The McDonald family is defending itself in the Supreme
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Court without legal representation. I ask the Minister for Public Works and Services to take possession of a letter I will hand to him in a moment and give it to the Attorney General, the Hon. Jeff Shaw, in another place so that he can act on this request from the McDonald family. I hope that this House will condemn the actions taken by Fisher and Keogh that have placed the McDonald family in this rather difficult position. The McDonalds are now in an even worse position. They are about to engage their annual shearers, but they are not in a financial position to pay for them because the caveat placed on the property inhibits them from borrowing any money.

I ask the Attorney General to consider the letter they have written and to ensure that justice prevails. Unfortunately it is another case in which the cost of justice is beyond many people in this State. Regardless of who is in power the legal system tends to provide for those in a wealthy position and those most able to retain the best legal representation. They are also the people for whom justice is most likely to prevail. I have had several discussions with the McDonalds and I sympathise with their dire predicament. Given the fact that no legal aid has been forthcoming - in fact it has been refused - and no pro bono cases are available from solicitors, it leaves either me or the McDonalds to defend the case against a $10 million suit which would leave the McDonalds destitute. I would therefore ask the Minister for Public Works and Services to take up this matter with the Attorney General, to ensure that this letter gets to him and to ask him to respond to the McDonald family. [Time expired.]

Mr KNIGHT (Campbelltown - Minister for Public Works and Services, Minister for the Olympics, and Minister for Roads) [6.59]: Obviously, I am not in a position to comment on the merits on the case that the honourable member for Monaro has put to the House, but I would like to make one brief comment on procedure. The honourable member knows that the Attorney General's office is within this building. If the honourable member has a letter to deliver to him, he should deliver that letter to the Attorney General's office. It is not a function of private members' statements for the honourable member to ask other members of the Parliament to act as mailman for him. I urge the honourable member to pursue the matter with the vigour he believes it should be pursued with, by delivering the letter to the Attorney General - this evening.


Mr GIBSON (Londonderry) [7.00]: I wish to raise a problem that was created in the Londonderry area by the former Government. Over the past seven years there was opposition to health expenditure at Nepean Hospital, in one area in particular, and lack of funding in that one area of need has put lives in danger in western Sydney. Experts in the field of urology say that one urologist is needed for every 70,000 people. Undoubtedly that could be said of most health services in western Sydney. However, at Nepean Hospital there is one part-time urologist, a man who has been there a long time, who is not getting any younger and will soon retire. A second urologist has been at that hospital for seven or eight years, but unfortunately he plans to retire in a few weeks' time.

The previous Government knew of the situation at Nepean Hospital, was aware of the need for urgency there, but did nothing about it. The urologist at Nepean Hospital, the man who is going to retire shortly, had to give away routine examinations of people with urological problems five years ago because he did not have time to do them. There is a two-year waiting list to see any urologist at the hospital. Non-cancer operations were stopped years ago. Non-trauma treatments were completely out of the question. In his surgery even today there is a four- to five-month waiting list, and that is just to have a routine examination. The situation cannot be improved because he just does not have the manpower to do it. At Concord there is no waiting time at all for an examination by a urologist.

This information was conveyed many time to the former Government, but it neglected it. Nepean Hospital services about 300,000 people. According to medical experts, not one or two but five urologists are needed for that area. Yet people out there have had to manage for the past seven years with only two urologists - really only one, because the other was in semi-retirement. That deplorable position did not change in the time the coalition Government was in office. People were dying because they could not get their problems attended to, because there was no one they could go to for attention. Most of us males, by the time we turn 60, will become infected in some way and will need treatment from a urologist. Most of us, fortunately, will not have cancerous conditions, but many will.

Many of the lives lost in the past seven years could have been saved if these deplorable conditions at Nepean Hospital had been rectified earlier. To many men living in that part of western Sydney during the past seven years, the previous coalition Government gave death sentences. That is not an exaggeration. People out there have been waiting for treatment for a long time. Between Richmond and Campbelltown, a part of western Sydney that has a massive population, there are only five urologists. That is scandalous. I offer the following case to illustrate the seriousness of the problem in Sydney. One patient who had a vasectomy has been waiting since 1989 to have his vasectomy reversed. I speak about that scandalous situation tonight to condemn the previous Government and also to make my party, now in Government, aware of the need for urologists and urology care in that part of western Sydney.

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Mr CHAPPELL (Northern Tablelands) [7.05]: I bring to the attention of the House the probable closure of the New England Educational Diagnostic Centre, the NEED Centre, at Armidale. I have just been advised that the positions of coordinator and clerical assistant at the NEED Centre will be terminated from the end of this year. This is a significant body blow to the education infrastructure of the north and north-west of this State. It takes away an essential service to the children, the parents, the schools and the educational community of my electorate and beyond. The background of the NEED Centre must be put on the record so the House will understand just what a tragedy this decision to withdraw yet another service to the education community will be.

The NEED Centre is one of 10 special education centres in New South Wales. Six of the centres are in the country and four are in metropolitan parts of New South Wales. The NEED Centre was the first of these centres. It was started in 1975 as a community-based facility, with input from the then Armidale College of Advanced Education and the University of New England. It was established to meet a real need to address early learning disabilities both in a direct service to individual children and their parents and teachers. It had the very real advantage of being able to access educational expertise at the professional and academic levels, and also other academic expertise at the university and medical and therapeutic services available in the community.

This special set of circumstances available to us in Armidale, with a pioneering group of dedicated professionals, was harnessed to help children with disabilities receive the very best chance to recover their rightful place in the educational mainstream. Following recognition by the Government of the day that improved support services were needed for children with learning difficulties and other specific disabilities, special education centres were established in a number of areas. I understand that each centre took a local approach according to specific local needs and available services. In 1990 the NEED Centre became part of that network of special education centres but it also retained its very special range of services. For instance, not only does the centre continue to provide a high level of service to the children and classroom teachers but it services the education profession in other ways.

The centre interacts closely with student teachers from the education faculty at our university, providing a most worthwhile and very practical professional learning opportunity for both the students and their academic teachers. It provides a real base for a team-centred approach to dealing with the needs of children throughout the north and north-west. Health professionals in psychology, in speech pathology and occupational therapy all combined with teaching professionals to work on an individual casework basis to maximise outcomes. This interaction and the teamwork approach has not only been of extreme benefit to children with learning and other specific disabilities, it has been of great mutual benefit to each of the professionals involved. There are some 200 cases of direct student support each year, services which will no longer be available to the current level and standard if these positions are closed down.

There are usually from 50 to 80 instances of consultancy support to schools throughout the north and the north-west, particularly to teachers in isolated schools who are often confronted with severe cases of disability for which no teacher can reasonably be expected to be equipped. And there are up to 200 direct contacts each year from parents who hear of the NEED Centre and phone up on their own initiative on behalf of their children to say, "Help! Tell us how to help our children to cope at school. There is something wrong. Please help!" Training and development of individual teachers and groups of teachers out in the region's schools is a key function of staff, including the coordinator - and a service which could not be provided without the back-up of adequate clerical support. The NEED Centre programs are directed towards helping our schools to help themselves, and are based on constant upgrading of skills within and between the schools.

Further, I must say there is cooperation between all schools including parochial schools and other private schools throughout the region. The programs are based on diagnosis, on program design, on service delivery and follow-up. This is a top-flight professional educational service to our educators in the north. The NEED Centre was established locally to meet a real need. It has survived for 20 years, and it continues to provide a truly essential service. In these difficult times the centre must have State Government funding support in order to survive. If the coordinator and clerical assistant positions are removed, the NEED Centre will cease to exist as we know it. I say to the Minister for Education and Training: please, for the good of the children, the parents, teachers and health professionals of my electorate and beyond, for goodness sake review this decision, apprise yourself of what the NEED Centre has become and of the benefits it delivers to our community, and turn this decision around.


Ms HALL (Swansea) [7.10]: The ambulance station at Doyalson has a long history of problems. The previous Government took steps to address the problems last year by appointing two additional ambulance officers. A revised roster was introduced this year to provide crews of two officers. There has been a problem with workers compensation, and one officer has been on workers compensation for quite some time. An additional
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relief worker was placed at Doyalson ambulance station, but despite all efforts there is still a major problem. The community is extremely concerned about the situation. The Munmorah and Chain Valley Bay progress associations formed a committee to bring the matter to my attention and the attention of the Deputy Premier, Minister for Health, and Minister for Aboriginal Affairs. I have received numerous letters from people telling how lives have been threatened because of the situation.

I congratulate the Minister for Health for taking action in this matter. He listened to the residents and to the doctors who expressed a concern about the threat to lives. A completely objective review was undertaken by a team comprising officers of the Department of Health, the Ambulance Service of New South Wales and a member of the union. Doyalson ambulance station was compared with ambulance stations at Boolaroo, Cooranbong, Toukley, Wyong, Bulli and Warilla. The review covered the period from 1 May to 30 June 1995 and used data from the Ambulance Service. Staffing levels at Doyalson were examined and used as a benchmark against other ambulance stations with similar demography and characteristics. Incidents of single-officer responses were compared with those in other stations.

The report showed that staffing levels at Doyalson ambulance station were adequate, but that officers took a large amount of sick leave. At Doyalson 50.3 man hours were taken in sick leave, compared with 22.6 man hours at the station with the next highest level of sick leave. Incidents of single-crewing were about average. The Deputy Premier has given an undertaking that the Ambulance Service will work with officers at a local level to find solutions to the management issues identified in the review of staffing levels at Doyalson. Obviously the major management issue is the high level of sick leave, but that may be associated with the stress of the job. The Minister has made a commitment to solve the problem at Doyalson and I, as the local member, will guarantee residents of the central coast within the Swansea electorate that I will ensure that the problem is solved. [Time expired.]


Mr KERR (Cronulla) [7.15]: This afternoon the Minister for Transport mentioned an unfortunate and atypical incident that occurred at Cronulla. I draw the attention of the House to the failure of the Government to provide funds as promised to the Cronulla police station. Before the election an upgrade of Cronulla police station was promised, at a cost of $500,000. Plans were under way for that upgrade. The recent tragic event underlines the need for the upgrade. The honourable member for Swansea spoke about stress and working conditions of ambulance officers, who do a tremendous job. So, too, do our police, who are society's front line in the war against crime and violence.

Police and citizens in the Cronulla electorate should have the best available facilities. A promise was made and that promise should be fulfilled. There is no allocation in the budget for additional facilities at Cronulla police station. That is a tragedy. A government has no greater responsibility than to ensure the protection of the life and property of its citizens. I call upon the Government to fulfil its promise to provide adequate facilities for police at Cronulla so they can do their job. I ask the Government to respond to demands for public safety.

On the subject of public safety, the honourable member for Bulli, with me, has been working towards providing a boat ramp at Bundeena. Under the previous Government an environmental study of the area was carried out, because the National Parks and Wildlife Service is involved. Bundeena and Maianbar residents have patiently waited for the installation of this vital facility and have cooperated with all government departments and authorities. It seems now that the ramp will not be installed. I would welcome advice from the appropriate Minister about the matter. As I said, it is a matter that both the honourable member for Bulli and I have worked on.

Mr O'Farrell: You will have to halve it.

Mr KERR: Unfortunately, the facility cannot be halved. We will get all of it. I make this plea on the basis of public safety. It would be a pity if a drowning occurred in the area because a rescue boat or craft could not be launched. A launching ramp would provide residents with the opportunity to undertake recreational activities. The third aspect of public safety is a matter that should concern honourable members on both sides of the House, I refer to the sewage treatment plant at Potter Point. The previous Government was committed to spending $170 million to upgrade the treatment works. This Government committed itself to the provision of least $130 million but, once again, the budget makes no provision for that expenditure even though during the election campaign one could have been forgiven for thinking that the election would be determined on the upgrading of the sewage treatment plant.

Mr O'Farrell: The former member for Cronulla delivered the budget.

Mr KERR: I have been reminded that Mike the knife, a former member for Cronulla, delivered the budget and, indeed, cut opportunities for the people of Cronulla.

Mr O'Farrell: How can he show his face in Cronulla?

Mr KERR: I have been asked how he can show his face in Cronulla. I assure the honourable member that the Treasurer does not show his face a great deal in the Cronulla electorate, and he will show it even less now. The member in another place has a genuine concern - [Time expired.]

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Mr MILLS (Wallsend) [7.20]: Honourable members may notice that I am wearing a pink ribbon in my lapel. It was purchased when I attended a breakfast on Monday this week to mark Australia's second Breast Cancer Day. The breakfast was attended by more than 200 people at Newcastle city hall. It was hosted by the patron of Breast Cancer Day in the Hunter, Mrs Margaret McNaughton. I pay tribute to Margaret McNaughton for her outstanding dedication to the advancement of a number of causes to help needy people, especially those in the Hunter, over nine years. In addition to working for the advancement of cancer services and women's health, she was the patron and chief lobbyist for Ronald McDonald House at John Hunter Hospital. She is most generous with her time and her musical talent in visiting groups of the elderly. Margaret was a popular lady mayoress of Newcastle for those nine years, and it is to her great credit that she is continuing her work for cancer and other causes.

The importance of Breast Cancer Day is to raise awareness about the problems in order to improve understanding and to gain commitment to involvement in solving these problems. All of us can make a difference. Breast cancer is the largest cause of death among women up to the age of 65 years. In Australia six to seven women die each day from breast cancer - that is, about 2,500 women each year. More than 7,000 Australian women get breast cancer each year, and about one-third of those will eventually die from it. Also, 50 to 60 men get breast cancer each year in Australia.

Much has been done in the past 20 years. Early detection screening is now widespread, and millions of women have entered screening programs. In the Hunter region, most areas have reached the initial target of 70 per cent of women aged 50 to 69 years, 60,000 women have been screened and 400 breast cancers have been detected. The program has been successful in the Hunter because it reaches to all the country towns, from Taree to Wyong and west to Merriwa. The van and equipment that enable that to be done have been supplied from funds raised by people and businesses of the Hunter through NBN telethons - the most successful telethons in Australia. The Hunter Valley cancer appeal, led by Alwyn Holmes, has provided valuable community leadership and fundraising support.

A breast cancer committee is active in the Parliament. Elizabeth Price, the wife of the Deputy Speaker, is active in that committee, as are the Hon. Jennifer Gardiner and former members of the Legislative Council Judith Walker and Beryl Evans, who continue their involvement. The committee raises funds for breast cancer research and raises awareness among members of Parliament. The Hunter region is also a centre of research. The Australia-New Zealand breast cancer trials group is based at the Newcastle Mater Misericordiae Hospital. The top class, integrated research, screening and treatment programs in the region are led by Professor John Forbes, Director of Surgical Oncology at Newcastle Misericordiae Hospital. The programs involve support from the area health service, the University of Newcastle, the breast cancer support group, general practitioners and Newcastle Mater Misericordiae Hospital.

Professor Forbes reported to the breakfast on the significant breakthrough from research. Firstly, chemotherapy works. One no longer has to die from a lump in the breast. Tamoxifen is the drug used; initially the treatment time was two years but it is now down to 10 weeks. Secondly, mastectomy can now be avoided in most cases. It is safe to keep the breast. Thirdly, the efficacy of screening has been confirmed in research. Early detection is the most important key to a reduction in the number of deaths. At the breakfast Professor Forbes posed some questions for new research. First, which patients should have radiotherapy when mastectomy has been avoided? Secondly, what factors may increase the likelihood of breast cancer developing? The factors include absence of pregnancies, hormone replacement therapy, low exercise and inherited genes. On the question of inherited genes, Professor Forbes said:

We have also learned much in the last year about the particular inherited genes that seem to cause breast cancer when it runs in families, for example BRCA1 (Breast Cancer Gene 1). The Hunter Area Health Service supported a visit by one of our genetic researchers, Peter Colley, to the laboratories in the U.S.A. where the gene BRCA1 was first identified. Peter has now established a new test for the gene for the first time in Australia here in the Hunter. This is of particular value to women, as if they have this gene they are very likely to develop breast cancer (a 90% risk). We must clarify the mechanisms that control BRCA1 and the molecules it produces. This again is daunting, but also exciting and rewarding research.

Thirdly, can cancer be prevented? High risk cancer groups are being investigated for that. Much remains to be done. The lifetime risk for women getting breast cancer is one in 12. There are no strategies for younger women. There is no screening for the under 40-year-old women's group. Younger women need new and better treatments. Much remains to be done to tackle breast cancer. [Time expired.]


Mr ELLIS (South Coast) [7.25]: I speak on behalf of the underprivileged on the south coast. During the recent election campaign the present Minister for Education was widely quoted as saying:

Labor will continue to fund all present state funded employment programmes. Specifically, we will continue to fund the Mature Workers, Workplace and Get Started programmes in their current form.

Now we find that the budget for the workplace for youth and get started employment programs has been slashed. The most distasteful factor of this
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broken promise is that it is a direct attack on youth, and all for the sake of transferring a measly $17 million or so to other projects that Labor wants to subsidise. It is an attack on a sector of the community that is least able to fend for itself. It is an attack on the underprivileged, the underskilled and the poor in our community. It is an attack on rural communities, which have been disadvantaged by the city orientated policies of this Government.

The Government is responsible for ensuring that our youth are supported and not set aside. The program in the Shoalhaven cost the former Government $54,000 a year - a princely sum. If that amount is spread among the 288 people whom it helped, it works out at $187.50 a person. For that $187.50 each of the participants regained some self-esteem and hope that there is a light at the end of the long tunnel. Instead, this crumb is to be denied to the community that so desperately needs it. Why cannot the Minister exercise the courage and integrity to reverse this outrage? Why does he not go in to bat for those in our community who need all the help that they can get? At present 1,400 people aged between 15 and 25 years are unemployed in the Nowra area. More than 30 per cent of people in the Shoalhaven are unemployed - that would be one of the highest figures in the State. This does not include those in outlying areas who have even less facilities and access to opportunities. Nowra has its problems, not the least of which is a situation that effectively discourages investment and growth.

The environmental grant schemes saturating the area mean that opportunities for job-creating industries are limited. Ecotourism is an economic illusion and will not get the Shoalhaven going. The net effect is that our kids will be forced to leave their homes and families to go to the cities where they will not be able to compete because of their inability to gain access to the necessary training to which youths in the city have access. Country areas have been deprived because the necessary infrastructure, inadequate as it is, is being undermined and starved of funds. If the Government has any semblance of responsibility or morality left, it will reverse its cynical decision. As for country residents, the budget will create an economic and social famine in rural areas. It is a well-demonstrated fact that unemployment is linked to a host of social problems, including crime, suicide, drug taking and violence, and has led to the breakdown of the family unit. It is an economic cost to the community to funnel in scarce resources to combat social dysfunction.

The Government has chosen to aggravate the problem, rather than address it. Services and jobs are being transferred to city centres and decision making has been centralised. The south coast already has one of the highest rates of youth unemployment and vandalism in the State, and this will only add to it. I cannot believe that the Government could advocate poverty and misery as a means to a political end, but this seems to be the case. I can think of no other reason that such a small amount that means so much to so many people would be taken away.


Mr CLOUGH (Bathurst) [7.30]: I draw to the attention of the Minister for Roads a matter relating to a stretch of road on the approach to the City of Bathurst, between Mount Lambie and Lawsons Creek, which was commenced by the previous Government and completed when Labor took government in March. The Minister is familiar with it because he was there on the day it was opened. It is certainly an improvement on what it was. However, a problem arises because of the heavy frosts that fall in the region during the winter months which cause black ice to form on the surface making the road extremely dangerous. There has been one fatality on that stretch of roadway already this year, and this has resulted in the Roads and Traffic Authority in consultation with police restricting the speed limit on the roadway to 80 kilometres per hour.

I support the 80-kilometre speed restriction during the winter months because the road is dangerous. I also support the traffic police ensuring that motorists obey that restriction. It makes me very angry when I see people during winter months drive at speeds in excess of the limit. In most cases they are not the ones who pay the penalty; it is usually the careful driver coming in the opposite direction who becomes the victim. During the summer months the problem does not arise. My purpose in mentioning this matter tonight to the Minister is to ask that a variable speed limit be applied in this sector. During summer months the speed limit could be 110 kilometres per hour, but when winter comes I would be in favour of a limit of 80 kilometres per hour being imposed. Motorists would soon realise, because of adequate sign posting, that the speed limit is variable, and if they are detected doing in excess of 80 kilometres at a time when the sector is so designated, bad luck for them. If they do not observe the speed limit, they deserve to pay the consequences.

I wish also to draw the Minister's attention to a problem intersection in the city of Bathurst - the intersection of Stewart Street and Durham Street. I am very familiar with it because I live on the corner of the intersection. It is earmarked for upgrading in the current budget. My request to the Minister is to have that work brought forward because a week rarely goes by when there is not an accident directly out the front of my home. My wife and I have got used to the screech of brakes, tyres slipping on the roadway and the resultant "bang" of vehicles colliding. When an accident takes place we go out the front to see if police and ambulance are required. Frankly, we are getting sick of it. I ask the Minister to give consideration to recommending a variable speed limit for the road between Mount Lambie and Lawson Creek and having installed
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some better form of traffic control on the corner of Stewart Street and Durham Street than already exists. At that intersection accidents are caused by careless motorists not observing give-way signs. Of course they wring their hands when they hit someone or something. [Time expired.]

Mr KNIGHT (Campbelltown - Minister for Public Works and Services, Minister for the Olympics, and Minister for Roads) [7.35]: I recall when I opened the road upgrading at Mount Lambie earlier this year I mentioned that the honourable member for Bathurst fell into a unique category of member. There are members who will take no for an answer; there are members who will not take no for an answer; and then there is the honourable member for Bathurst who usually will not even take yes for an answer - he wants even more. That is perhaps why he is held in such esteem by his constituents; he is able to get more and more for them. With regard to the intersection at Stewart Street and Durham Street I have allocated funds in

this year's budget to address the problem referred to, not because the honourable member for Bathurst lives nearby but because the intersection badly needs attention. I will see what I can do to make sure that that work is completed promptly.

With regard to the problem of black ice on the Mount Lambie stretch of road, I will ask the Roads and Traffic Authority to give consideration to approving differential speed limits. There are some administrative difficulties involved with getting motorists used to such changes, and I envisage some strange representations from constituents to the effect that they were confused by the change of the speed limit at different times of the year. Notwithstanding that, it is a sensible suggestion, and it is one that should be pursued. I will ask the Roads and Traffic Authority in consultation with the police to look at it in detail.

Private members' statements noted.

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