Debate resumed from an earlier hour.

Mr THOMAS GEORGE (Lismore) [4.20 p.m.]: The overview of the Education Amendment Bill 2009 states:

The object of this Bill is to change the current school leaving age of 15 years by requiring children:

(a) to complete Year 10 of secondary education (unless they have reached the age of 17 years), and

(b) if they have completed Year 10 but have not reached the age of 17 years:

(i) to continue with their school education, or

(ii) to participate on a full-time basis in approved education or training or, if they have reached the age of 15 years, in paid work.

Participation in approved education or training includes an apprenticeship, a TAFE or other vocational course or a university course.

The hypocrisy of this Government! Here it is, encouraging students to stay at school or go to TAFE until they are 17 years of age. For some years I have been complaining about the number of TAFE courses that have been taken away from young people in the Northern Rivers area. And as for the cost—user pays! How do young people survive in country and regional New South Wales? Yesterday we heard the member for East Hills comment about dead-end jobs. I am the product of a dead-end job. I left school in year 10, and I was quite proud of it at the time. I am certainly not proud of it now. In saying that, I was one of the guinea pigs. I was one of the first in the Wyndham scheme that went to year 10, and that class continued on to year 12. However, I was able to convince my parents that I had enough ability to leave school at that age. My parents accepted that. I wish now, when I look back with the benefit of hindsight, that I did not leave school at that age.

As the member for Pittwater said yesterday, this Government is sending out the wrong message. I remind members what the Government has done with Seaforth TAFE. It is encouraging students to stay at school, yet it is taking away what is needed to provide opportunities to young people. Marjorie Goward is the principal of Murwillumbah TAFE and Len Parkes runs the certificate III automotive technology—light and heavy vehicles—course. They do a tremendous job in the Northern Rivers area. However, people in my electorate who need to get to a TAFE course have to have a motor vehicle—there is no public transport to convey them from areas within the Lismore electorate to Murwillumbah to attend a TAFE course. Len Parkes has done a mighty job with his students. The course is recognised within both the light and heavy vehicle industries. The college at Murwillumbah needs extra space and it needs a new building, but what is the Government doing about improving facilities to encourage young people? Nothing.

That is why I referred to the hypocrisy of the Government. It is encouraging people to stay at school, but it is not providing facilities for those 15-year-old, 16-year-old and 17-year-old students who need workplace-based training and access to TAFE. Those facilities are not available. Another issue has come to my attention. Both last year and this year a memorandum was sent to principals of the Department of Education and Training regarding responsible service of alcohol courses being provided to school students. The memorandum stated that it appeared that some private registered training organisations are currently offering training in responsible service of alcohol to minors. As a result, some career advisers in schools may encourage school students under the age of 18 years to enrol in responsible service of alcohol courses delivered by private registered training organisations. The memorandum states:

The encouraging of minors to undertake training in responsible service of alcohol constitutes a potential breach of legislated requirements and potential issues in relation to duty of care.

The memorandum quotes different parts of the Act, and concludes by saying:

Minors are unlikely to have the life experience and related skills to be able to implement strategies that meet harm minimisation legislation and the objectives arising from the New South Wales Summit on Alcohol Abuse 2003. Inappropriate actions by students in regard to access to alcohol may attract negative attention to the individual school or the Department of Education and Training.

I strongly encourage all schools to desist from encouraging minors to undertake training in the responsible service of alcohol.

The document is signed by the Regional Director of the North Coast. In the real world, the young people who are going to leave school at 17 or after year 12 when they are nearly 18 want a job. Where are most of the jobs in country and regional areas? If work is available, if there is casual work, it is in the hospitality industry. In this place we have made alcohol available at restaurants, hotels and bottle shops. If one wants a job in those places one has to do this course. Here we have the Department of Education and Training saying not to encourage students to do these courses because they do not have the real life experience, but they are not doing the course to learn to drink. I hope that by doing the course these people will get employment and learn some responsibility in relation to alcohol. I was approached by one of the private registered training organisations referred to, and I will read part of its letter. First, it draws attention to the fact that an almost identical memorandum to the one sent this year was sent last year. The letter states:

In the case of the most recent memorandum we would again like an opportunity to respond to what we believe is a misinformed directive to Principals over the issue of training minors in Responsible Service of Alcohol. Our response is outlined as follows:

1. Memo states: "The encouraging of minors to undertake training in responsible service of alcohol constitutes a potential breach of legislated requirements and potential issues in relation to duty of care".

Response: Our organisation is a local North Coast Registered Training Organisation who has been delivering RSA & RCG Training to many North Coast Schools for a number of years and we can very confidently confirm that we have made no breach in legislated requirements. As noted in our previous response, training undertaken for schools by our organisation is conducted away from licensed premises with the majority of courses being conducted at the relevant schools with resources provided and/or approved by the NSW Office of Liquor Gaming & Racing Authority The use of role play (as recommended in the training package), case studies and DVD are used in the training process and to be very clear, we make every effort to ensure the vast majority of courses delivered to school students are not conducted on licensed premises and in no way are minors exposed to or provided access to alcohol of any kind.

We further reiterate that we take great care to promote responsible service of alcohol practices. All our RSA trainers have been approved by CLGCA to deliver the course and all are experienced industry professionals who are well aware of the liquor laws and who are committed to the principles which underpin Responsible Service of Alcohol. Contrary to Mr Haigh's assertion that "encouraging minors to undertake training in responsible service of alcohol constitutes potential issues in relation to duty of care" we believe we have a duty of care to ensure young people have adequate and accurate information concerning alcohol related issues so that they make informed choices and we believe that providing RSA courses to school students—who are likely to be consuming alcohol already, (albeit illegally and this we do not condone) or who will seek employment in the hospitality industry where they will be exposed to alcohol—is one strategy which contributes to young people making more informed and responsible choices.

We have received extensive positive feedback from students, school teachers and parents about our RSA courses in schools

The letter goes on to answer all the accusations or concerns outlined in the letter from Peter Haigh. This organisation has been continually providing suitable training for school students as well as training backpackers and other young people through the Northern Rivers area. It has been doing it successfully. Again we have one department saying to young people that they need to do these courses in order to work in certain industries. On the other hand the Department of Education and Training is advising principals and schoolteachers not to take part because there may be a lack of duty of care to their students that are taking the courses.

I call on the Government to get itself organised. All departments should be sending out one message. If the Government wants children to stay at school it should provide them with the facilities and the options to do courses while they are still attending school so that when they turn 17 or leave in year 10 they can go out in the real world and probably secure employment. Under the current regime we are expecting young people to do these courses but in country and regional areas we are not providing as many opportunities at TAFE as was previously the case. Work-based training has been a success and many young people have stayed at school because they have the opportunity to go to a workplace one day a week. It has also retained their interest in school. I encourage the continuation of that. Finally, in country and regional areas and coastal areas there is the opportunity for young people to pick up supplementary work in restaurants, hotels or the tourism industry. I encourage the withdrawal of this advice to the schools and urge Government departments to work together to provide young people with opportunities.

Mr PHIL KOPERBERG (Blue Mountains—Parliamentary Secretary) [4.33 p.m.]: I will make a brief contribution to the Education Amendment Bill 2009. Everyone in our community wants the best for our young people. Parents, teachers, business and the wider community all want our young people to be able to build fulfilling, rewarding lives. Everyone has a clear interest in seeing that our young people have the education that will give them the broadest range of opportunities as they move into adulthood. We need to be sure that all young people have the opportunity to obtain the skills, knowledge and confidence to enjoy a rewarding future and to participate fully in society.

In New South Wales we can be rightly proud of the education system we have built. The results of national and international tests demonstrate that our students are doing well. Most of our young people are able to take full advantage of their primary and secondary education and make very successful transitions to work, further study, training or higher education. But, importantly, there are some young people who end their education too early each year—too early both for their own interests and those of the wider community—and who do not find their way into stable work, training or higher education. This situation cannot be allowed to continue. All our young people matter. Every single one deserves our interest, commitment and support.

The purpose of this bill is to raise the school leaving age to require that all New South Wales students complete year 10 and then continue to engage with school education, vocational training, an apprenticeship or work until they reach the age of 17. The Government realises that success in today's world depends on the achievement of a minimum standard of education. Young people who leave school before completing year 10 are particularly at risk of being left behind at a time when more and more jobs require a higher level of skills and further qualifications. For example, we know that students who do not successfully complete their schooling are three times more likely to be unemployed, and will receive lower wages when they do have a job. Leaving school early has also been shown to lead to poor completion rates in later attempts to gain vocational education and training qualifications.

The School Certificate completed at the end of year 10 is the absolute minimum qualification that almost all employers now demand. As the Member for Maitland noted, even to obtain an apprenticeship in a traditional trade most employers now require an applicant to have the year 10 certificate. It is appropriate that this be the minimum requirement by law. But this legislation goes further than that. It asks young people who have finished year 10 to choose an option that will help prepare them for their future careers. Those who stay longer in education receive higher wages, have less unemployment throughout their lives and are more likely to go on to further study. As well as personal benefits, increasing student retention brings many benefits to society and the economy. These include improvements to overall wellbeing such as improved health, reduced crime and lower dependency on social services. That is why we have set ourselves a target to lift the number of young people successfully completing year 12 or an equivalent level of education or training to 90 per cent by 2016. This bill is an important part of our strategy towards achieving this target.

The Government has gone to great lengths to engage the wider community on this initiative. I note that the member for South Coast in her remarks claimed this bill had been rushed together quickly with little planning. Nothing could be further from the truth. During 2008 the Government organised a comprehensive process of community consultation on the proposals. A consultation paper was released in February 2008. A major ministerial summit was held in March that year. From April to August, regional consultation forums were organised by local members of Parliament right across New South Wales. The consultation showed very strong support for implementing changes that would lead to higher levels of education and training for our young people. It also showed strong support for further engagement by students after the completion of the compulsory period of schooling.

This bill is backed by a comprehensive resourcing package. The Premier spoke of a commitment in the order of $98 million per year for additional staff—both teachers and counsellors—and new facilities. The bill also comes on top of a large range of initiatives this Government has introduced to better engage our students. Other members have spoken of initiatives like expanded vocational subject options in schools and partnerships between schools and TAFE institutes.

I will speak briefly about the Trade Training Centre Program. New South Wales is not alone in understanding the importance of trade training for its young people. Last month the Deputy Prime Minister and the Premier together announced that schools in New South Wales would receive $93.9 million to build or refurbish trade or vocational education and training facilities in 86 schools. This is part of the Rudd Government's Trades Training Centres in Schools Program, which will provide $2.5 billion over 10 years to address shortages in traditional trades and emerging industries. Trades training centres will ensure that students have access to industry-standard high-quality training while completing their year 12 studies. This program complements the New South Wales trade schools program.

Other speakers have mentioned the significant investments that we have made in our trade schools—investing in training and job opportunities for our young people. The Federal Government's program means that we can provide even more skills-based apprentices and trainees, who can work, train and complete their Higher School Certificate in schools in New South Wales. Like our trades schools, these trades training centres will equip our students with the trade skills that are needed to grow our skills base. In this way we will help to make schools relevant for more young people as well as helping them to secure future employment in a highly competitive workforce. This bill was developed in consultation with the community and is backed by a significant program of reforms to make it work. I commend the bill to the House.

Mr MIKE BAIRD (Manly) [4.41 p.m.]: I speak to the Education Amendment Bill 2009 and commend the Government for doing everything possible to give kids a chance. Kids are given the best chance in life if they are provided with an education—the key to opening up opportunities that they might be able to pursue. Education is the way in which the youth of our State can achieve their full potential. This morning, when I attended a school assembly at Seaforth Public School and I looked into the faces of the audience, I saw a young generation of future leaders or future contributors to the New South Wales way of life. Education shapes and forms every student in this State.

I commend the teachers and school communities for spending many hours to give our kids an opportunity in life. The purpose of this bill, which is commendable, is to keep kids in education—to give them every chance in life to progress. Education sits parallel with the other side of the equation, that is, the culture of this Government. This legislation will result in increased costs but it is clear that those costs have not been articulated. This Government has allocated a token amount of about $100 million but if kids are to remain longer in schools there will be an added requirement for teachers, schools and TAFE institutions. How will this proposal be funded and how will it play out? This Government needs to develop a culture of accountability.

Lots of cheap points have been made about economic management. However, if this Government wants to manage this State responsibly it should cost any proposals before they are announced. Its proposals should be costed and understood and it should ensure that it delivers on its promises, which it has not done in the past. I refer to the ironic situation in my electorate. This bill will ensure that kids remain longer in schools, but this Government is attempting to close or sell off TAFE institutions in order to prop up the State budget. I ask the Minister to take heed of the motion that I have on the notice paper that refers to the Government selling off public education land to the tune of $240 million to prop up the State budget.

This bill is about protecting the future of our kids. However, if we are to educate our kids we need the facilities to do it. Seaforth TAFE has a role to play in public education and it should remain open to educate our kids. It is bad policy for any government to sell public education land to balance its budget. The Government should reconsider policies that will impact on future generations. I call on the Government to debate my motion. I call on the Government to include Seaforth TAFE as part of its strategy and to provide additional teachers and facilities. I commend the intent of the bill but I believe this Government has a lot more work to do.

Mr GREG PIPER (Lake Macquarie) [4.45 p.m.]: I speak in debate on the Education Amendment Bill 2009 and congratulate the Government on what is an important piece of legislation. In the purest sense this bill will assist in the building of this nation. This bill will build individuals, families and communities and it is important to continue to do that. I support this extremely important measure, which will require all children to complete year 10 and then continue with their schooling or engage in full-time paid work, or a combination of those things, until they reach the age of 17. At this critical time many of our students, for whatever reason, have chosen to drop out or not to participate in any gainful activity in their communities. It is a dangerous period in their psychological, emotional, intellectual and educative development. This bill seeks to address those issues.

Regardless of peer group, familial, or community pressures, our youth will be given the best opportunity to receive an education that will benefit them and the community in the future. Young people who have been subjected to a lot of peer group pressure and family problems have a poor attitude to developing their education base. This legislation will take poor decision making away from families and individuals. There are a large number of schools in the Lake Macquarie electorate and a mix of social opportunities for students from low socioeconomic areas, middle-income groups and wealthier areas. This bill will assist in balancing the opportunities available to them all. I commend the Government for introducing this bill, which I fully support.

Mr STEVE CANSDELL (Clarence) [4.48 p.m.] I support the Education Amendment Bill 2009. We must ensure that our children achieve a minimal educational standard. Studies show that children who remain longer at school have less chance of falling foul of the law and ending up in jail in later life. The bill sounds good in principle but I have some concerns about it. It is one thing to force children to stay at school but it is another thing to encourage them and make them want to stay at school. We already have a major problem in country New South Wales where the overwhelming majority of youth in our indigenous communities do not attend school. Often that is because the parents have never had an education and they do not give it much weight. If the Government intends to force these kids to stay at school and to penalise their parents if they do not attend school, more truancy officers will have to be employed and they will need to be given law enforcement powers if they are to be effective.

It will take a huge social effort to try to make a dysfunctional family get their children to school. In the Murray-Darling region and many other areas, especially those with large indigenous populations, there are major problems in getting kids to school. These kids end up in trouble because they are not at school. When they do go to school they are behind in their education, so they rebel and play up to get suspended or expelled; or they just do not bother going back. Perhaps the education system should be changed to cater for those kids who do not want to be at school. Their attention span is short and subjects like English, history and science do not appeal to them. Perhaps special trades classes could be established for them. Much more funding would be needed for external TAFE courses as well as for educators to cater for the extra 10,000 to 20,000 kids who will stay at school when the provisions of this bill come into effect.

There is no easy or cheap fix to make kids stay at school when they do not want to be there; there must be incentives to keep them there. Children aged 14, 15 or 16 who do not want to go to school will not stay just by being told, "You've got to stay at school until you do your School Certificate or until you're 17." Perhaps we need to work in conjunction with the Federal Government to provide more trades apprenticeships, which are lacking in country towns. When I was younger, every tradesperson employed an apprentice. Today very few small trades businesses have apprentices because they cannot afford them. They cannot afford the WorkCover requirements, the insurance or the rates of pay—not that apprentices are overpaid; the competition is so tough. The average tradesman now is aged in his early fifties, so in a few years we will be running short of tradesmen.

The State Government has the opportunity to work with the Federal Government to provide extra apprenticeships and ensure that trades courses and school subjects are appropriate to keep the attention of these kids. A couple of years ago a trial was conducted at Grafton; it was a last chance school for many kids with major behavioural problems aged between 13 and 15 years. I was asked to muck around with the kids and do a bit of boxing with them. The teacher said these kids studied maths, English and basic history courses, but in between had activities to amuse them, keep them interested and active. I took a friend with me who was a tai chi instructor. On the first day I made the mistake of doing a bit of boxing, mucking around with self-defence and then getting them to do some tai chi. As I said earlier, these kids have a very short attention span and tai chi was a little bit too much. On the next occasion they were told that they could not do the boxing if they did not do tai chi first. That is how you have to work with these kids because one size does not fit all.

Many families want their children to at least obtain their School Certificate or ensure that when they get their School Certificate they enter a trades course or obtain an apprenticeship—those kids are not a problem. We are talking about the many children who just do not bother going to school and their parents do not care. The number of these kids will increase by around 10,000 under the provisions of this bill. I do not know how we will force parents to get their kids to school. New section 23 (e) provides a defence to prosecution for parents who fail to send to school a child of compulsory school age. This section will be an out for nearly every child. As much as the wording of the bill sounds good and its intent is honourable, much more will be achieved if it can be implemented. However, I repeat, to get these kids to go to school and remain there will require keeping their interest to avoid them going through court action with their parents.

Ms VERITY FIRTH (Balmain—Minister for Education and Training, and Minister for Women) [4.55 p.m.], in reply: I thank the many Government members who spoke in this debate for their contributions. I thank also the Opposition members, who supported this important legislation and particularly those who spoke in the debate, for their contributions. It was wonderful that the member for Lake Macquarie spoke in the debate. It is great to have this bipartisan support. I particularly mention my Parliamentary Secretary, the member for Penrith, and also the member for Riverstone, who has a long history of involvement in and contributions to education policy in New South Wales; he gave an absolutely erudite speech about the history of education.

As the House is aware, this legislation aims to ensure New South Wales students maintain a competitive advantage in today's economy. As has already been outlined, the current school-leaving age of 15 years was set in 1943, when only a small number of young people stayed at school beyond the equivalent of year 10. Now, the situation is reversed—only a minority do not stay on to complete year 12. Few employment or tertiary entry-level positions do not require a Higher School Certificate or its equivalent. Successfully completing year 12 or its equivalent should no longer be optional. There are two clear reasons for this and this legislation is of vital importance for those purposes. Firstly, continued education is very much in the interests of young people and, second, it is of great benefit to the New South Wales and Australian economies.

The evidence is stark and uncompromising regarding young individuals: Australian Bureau of Statistics research shows that year 12 leavers who go on to further study have an unemployment rate of only 2.7 per cent, whilst year 10 or below leavers have an unemployment rate of 7.8 per cent. An early school leaver has more than double the risk of unemployment. Just as relevant is research regarding income levels. A 2005 study estimated that each year of education increases an individual's income by 10 per cent. In relation to the economy the evidence is just as clear-cut: higher educational attainment leads to a higher domestic product. Applied Economics has estimated that if the numbers of early school leavers are halved by 2050, the result will be a $1.5-1.7 billion gain to the New South Wales State economy. The OECD has said that an additional year's education would raise the level of productivity by between 3 per cent and 6 per cent.

In preparing for these changes the Government has consulted with parents, young people, those who work with and promote the interests of young people, and with industry. The community expressed clear and virtually unanimous support for these changes. I will quickly reiterate what the bill will do. From 2010 each student in New South Wales will complete year 10 as a minimum and continue to be engaged in some form of education, training or employment until they are 17 years old. This legislation has been designed specifically to give young people maximum flexibility in how they stay engaged in education for longer. The Act defines the minimum school-leaving age as the age at which a student completes year 10 of secondary education or the age of 17 years, whichever occurs first. The system will have the flexibility to allow for special circumstances affecting particular students; the Minister of the day will have the power to approve the completion of education in these circumstances.

The legislation also introduces a participation requirement so that every young person must participate in some form of education or training, or be in employment from the time they complete year 10 until they reach 17 years of age. For the majority of students, this will simply mean that they will stay at school. For others, the participation phase may include a vocational course or an apprenticeship or traineeship. The Government acknowledges that for some young people this will require us to work with them to develop solutions that best meet their specific needs, and we will back this up with support and resources to make sure every young person makes the right choices.

The Premier already has spoken of a commitment in the order of $98 million per year to ensure we can build the additional facilities and employ the additional staff—both teachers and counsellors—to make this change possible. But this bill also comes at a time when the Government has introduced a wide range of initiatives to engage our senior students. Vocational options within schools for senior school students have been expanded. Last year, more than 20,000 year 12 students—one-third of the total cohort—studied one or more vocational education and training courses for their High School Certificate. New South Wales students are enrolled in more than 54,000 vocational education and training courses in schools.

We have introduced school-based apprenticeships and traineeships, and opened 13 trade schools, with another 12 to open within this term of government, including one at Kingscliff. We also have announced 6,000 new government apprenticeships and cadetships over the next four years. This Government's Learn or Earn package provides any person up to the age of 18 with a guaranteed place at TAFE New South Wales. Despite Opposition claims, New South Wales has a right to be extremely proud of its TAFE system. TAFE New South Wales is the largest and best provider of vocational education and training in Australia. In the 2008-09 financial year, TAFE New South Wales has been provided with a record budget of more than $1.73 billion. This is an increase to the TAFE budget of $529 million since 1996-97.

Funding for TAFE New South Wales supports enrolments in more than 1,200 qualifications offered at more than 130 TAFE campuses across the State. People know that TAFE New South Wales qualifications increase their employability, wages and chances of promotion. The last decade has seen a big expansion in TAFE, with enrolments increasing by more than 73,000 since 1997. A number of members opposite raised the issue of TAFE fees. TAFE New South Wales, like other TAFEs and training organisations around Australia, charges fees, but these are lower than the fees of many other public and private training providers. TAFE New South Wales has a generous system of concessions and exemptions. All Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander students are exempt from paying the TAFE fee. All students enrolled in the 32 special access courses in reading, writing and employment readiness are exempt from paying the TAFE fee. Approximately 17 per cent of TAFE New South Wales enrolments are in these courses.

Students in receipt of many Commonwealth Government benefits pay only a concession fee of $50. Students with a disability are exempt from paying fees for one course each year and pay the $50 concession fee only if they enrol in a second course in the same year. Students who successfully complete the Higher School Certificate, or its equivalent, the Tertiary Preparation Certificate, have their fees fully refunded. In cases of severe financial hardship, TAFE Institute directors are able to waive the fee. This means that approximately one-third of all TAFE New South Wales students—or 183,000 students—pay $50 or less each year for their TAFE study.

I will respond quickly to a number of specific questions or issues raised by members. In relation to the issue raised by the member for Pittwatter, I point out that the ministerial discretion referred to in sections 5 (c) and 6 (d) of the Act allows for individuals in specific circumstances to write to the Minister seeking approval to enrol in other education or training not otherwise referred to specifically in sections 5 or 6. The Minister in these circumstances would seek advice on the relevant education or training program and determine whether it met the intent of the Act. Approval would then be at the Minster's discretion. This provides the relevant flexibility to cater for individual circumstances.

In response to the question raised by the member for Orange, I point out that the three months mentioned in the bill is intended to cover situations in which a student finds employment, but then their employment ceases. The bill requires that in these circumstances the young person must return to education, training or other work. Three months is a reasonable safety net that takes account of the specific changes in the work patterns of young people. It gives them the opportunity to find a new workplace if, for some reason, their employment ceases. Every student in every public school has access to the school counselling service. There are more than 1,000 support staff and more than 790 counsellors. Every public school has a welfare committee. Last month an additional 25 home school liaison officers were announced by the New South Wales Government as part of its response to the recent Wood inquiry.

The New South Wales Government also has provided more than $1.4 billion this financial year to support the learning of students in targeted equity groups, including low socioeconomic status communities in western and south-western Sydney, and in rural and remote New South Wales. While low socioeconomic status and isolation remain hurdles for an individual's educational success, no Government has done more to address them than has this Government over the last decade. This legislation will assist in the process. No-one can force young people to get the best out of their schooling, but governments have an obligation to make sure that opportunities exist for all. Education and training always will be the smartest investment any individual can make in themselves and their future. This legislation is a significant addition to both the future of individual young people in New South Wales and to the State's prosperity. I commend the bill to the House.

Question—That this bill be now agreed to in principle—put and resolved in the affirmative.

Motion agreed to.

Bill agreed to in principle.


Bill declared passed and transmitted to the Legislative Council with a message seeking its concurrence in the bill.