Mr JOHN AQUILINA (Riverstone—Leader of the House) [3.17 p.m.], by leave: I move:

That the following sessional orders be now adopted to come into effect from Tuesday 26 February 2008:

ELECTION OF SPEAKER AND PARTICIPATION IN PROCEEDINGSELECTION OF SPEAKER AND PARTICIPATION IN PROCEEDINGS

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 9 shall be read as follows:

9. (1) The Speaker shall be elected on the first sitting day of a new Parliament or whenever the office becomes vacant.

(2) Following election the Speaker, when not presiding, in accordance with section 31 of the Constitution Act 1902, is not precluded from participating in debate or discussion or from voting on any question.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 15 shall be read as follows:

15. (1) In the absence of the Speaker on a day when the House is sitting the Clerk shall inform the House and the Deputy Speaker shall perform the duties of the Speaker until the Speaker resumes the Chair.

(2) In the absence of both the Speaker and the Deputy Speaker on a day when the House is sitting the Assistant Speaker shall perform the duties of the Speaker.

(3) In the absence of the Speaker, Deputy Speaker and Assistant Speaker on a day when the House is sitting, a Temporary Speaker shall perform the duties of the Speaker.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 18 shall be read as follows:

18. If the Speaker, Deputy Speaker, Assistant Speaker and Temporary Speakers are all absent on a day when the House is sitting, the Clerk shall inform the House which shall, upon motion without notice, before any further business is conducted, proceed to the election of an Acting Speaker and:

(1) The Clerk shall preside for the election of an Acting Speaker in the same manner as for the election of Deputy Speaker.

(2) The Members present, if a quorum, may elect an Acting Speaker who shall perform the duties of the Speaker.

(3) If the House does not proceed to an election the matter shall stand adjourned until the next sitting day or if a sitting day has not been set, a date set by the Government, when the election of an Acting Speaker, if still necessary, shall take precedence of all other business.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 31 shall be read as follows:

31. The Clerk shall, after each sitting day, publish:

(1) The Votes and Proceedings.

(2) A Business Paper containing Notices of Motions and Orders of the Day.

(3) A Questions and Answers Paper.

(4) During any adjournment of the House for two weeks or more a Questions and Answers Paper will be published from time to time containing answers received.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 35 shall be read as follows:

35. The timing of bells is as follows:

Tuesdays (Government Business Day – First sitting day of the week)
Bells are rung at 12.45 p.m. 12.56 p.m. 12.58 p.m. 2.00 p.m. and at 2.13 p.m.

Wednesdays, Thursdays and FridaysWednesdays, Thursdays and Fridays
Bells are rung at 9.45 a.m. 9.56 a.m. and at 9.58 a.m.

After lunchAfter lunch
Bells are rung at 2.00 p.m. and at 2.13 p.m.

DivisionDivision
First bell 10 seconds, pause 10 seconds; second bell 10 seconds, pause 10 seconds; third bell 20 seconds. The doors are locked 4 minutes after the bells are first rung.

QuorumQuorum
One long continuous bell (for up to four minutes until a quorum is present in the Chamber).

House adjournmentHouse adjournment
Two short bells.

One long bellOne long bell
A continuous bell rung at the discretion of the Chair.

ADJOURNMENT AND NEXT MEETINGADJOURNMENT AND NEXT MEETING

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 46 shall be read as follows:

46. Unless otherwise ordered, the House shall be adjourned without motion moved at 7.00 p.m. on Tuesday and Wednesday, at 6.00 p.m. on Thursday and after the conclusion of Private Members' Statements on Friday.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 97 shall be read as follows:

97. The House shall conduct its business in the following routine:

TuesdaysTuesdays

1. At 1.00 p.m. (Speaker takes Chair)
2. General Business Notices of Motions and Private Members' Statements
3. At 2.15 p.m. (Speaker resumes Chair)
4. Ministerial Statements
5. Notices of Motions (Government Business, Bills, Business with Precedence)
6. Notices of Motions to be Accorded Priority
7. Question Time
8. Ministerial Statements
9. Papers
10. Committee Reports – Tabling
11. Petitions
12. Announcement of Matter of Public Importance
13. Placing or Disposal of Business
14. Motion Accorded Priority
15. Matter of Public Importance
16. Business with Precedence
17. At 4.30 p.m. Business before the House is interrupted for Government Business.
18. Any interrupted business lapses except when the House is considering Business with Precedence which will stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.
19 At 7.00 p.m. Adjournment. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.

Other Government Business Days (not Fridays)

1. At 10.00 a.m. (Speaker takes Chair)
2. General Business Notices of Motions and Private Members' Statements
3. Government Business concluding at 1.30 p.m. Any interrupted business shall stand as an order of the day for a later time.
4. At 2.15 p.m. (Speaker resumes Chair)
5. Ministerial Statements
6. Notices of Motions (Government Business, Bills, Business with Precedence and notices to be the subject of a motion to re-order later in the sitting)
7. Notices of Motions to be Accorded Priority
8. Question Time
9. Ministerial Statements
10. Papers
11. Committee Reports – Tabling
12. Petitions
13. Announcement of Matter of Public Importance
14. Re-ordering of General Business Orders of the Day (for Bills) and General Business (Notices of Motions)
15. Placing or Disposal of Business
16. Motion Accorded Priority
17. Matter of Public Importance
18. Business with Precedence
19. At 4.30 p.m. Business before the House is interrupted for Government Business.
20. Any interrupted business lapses except when the House is considering Business with Precedence which will stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.
21. At 7.00 p.m. Adjournment. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.

General Business DaysGeneral Business Days

1. At 10.00 a.m. (Speaker takes Chair)
2, General Business Notices of Motions
3, General Business Notices of Motions for Bills
(concluding not later than 10.30 a.m.)
4. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow with precedence of other General Business Notices of Motions for Bills.
5. General Business Orders of the Day for Bills
(concluding not later than 11.30 a.m.)
Any interrupted business shall stand as an order of the day for a later time with precedence of other General Business Orders of the Day for Bills.
General Business Notices of Motions or Orders of the Day (not being Bills) concluding at 1.00 p.m.
Any interrupted business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow with precedence of other General Business (not for Bills) concluding at 1.30 p.m.
6. At 2.15 p.m. (Speaker resumes the Chair)
7. Ministerial Statements
8. Notices of Motions (Government Business, Bills, Business with Precedence)
9. Question Time
10. Ministerial Statements
11. Papers
12. Committee Reports – Tabling
13. Petitions
14. Placing or Disposal of Business
15. Business with Precedence
16. Government Business
17. At 4.15 p.m. Private Members' Statements. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.
18. 6.00 p.m. Adjournment. Any interrupted item of business shall lapse.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 98 shall be read as follows:

98. On any Friday upon which the House sits, whether as a continuation of the sitting of the previous day or as a separate sitting day:

(1) Government Business shall have precedence of all other business in the Routine of Business.
(2) No quorums shall be called and any divisions called shall be deferred, set down as orders of the day for the next sitting day and determined after Question Time.
(3) At 1.00 p.m. Consideration of committee reports presented or the next item of business shall be called. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.
(4) At 1.30 p.m. Private Members' Statements, after which the House shall adjourn without motion until the next sitting day. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 101 shall be read as follows:

101. The procedure for establishing the program for General Business Days is as follows:

(1) On the sitting day preceding a General Business Day, Members shall advise the Clerk in writing by 12.00 noon which General Business Notices of Motions for Bills, Orders of the Day for Bills, or Notices of Motions (not for Bills) standing in their name on the Business Paper are to be postponed. Party Whips may also advise the Clerk in writing of which items of General Business standing in the name of the Members of their party are to be postponed.
(2) The first ten notices on the Business Paper not advised to be postponed by 12.00 noon on the day preceding a General Business Day, will be deemed to be proceeding. Any General Business Order of the day for Bills or Notice of Motion re-ordered by the House to have precedence in accordance with Standing Orders 97 and 106 will retain such precedence.
(3) On a General Business Day, a Member may, without debate:
(a) withdraw or postpone any notice of motion standing in their name on the Business Paper for that day.
(b) postpone or, on motion, discharge an Order of the day standing in their name on the Business Paper for that day.
(c) discharge an Order of the day for a Bill on motion, without debate or amendment, "That the Order of the day be discharged", followed by a motion moved forthwith, without debate or amendment "That the Bill be withdrawn".

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 108 shall be read as follows:

108. The procedure for General Business Notices of Motions and Private Members' Statements is as follows:

(1) At the commencement of the sittings on Tuesday and Wednesday, Private Members' Statements will follow the giving of General Business Notices of Motions.
(2) (a) At 4.15 p.m. on Thursday and at 1.30 p.m. on Friday, the business before the House shall be interrupted for the taking of Private Members' Statements.
(b) The interrupted business shall stand as an Order of the day for tomorrow.
(c) If at the time of interruption:
(i) A division is in progress – the division shall be completed and any further questions put to conclude the matter and the result announced.
(ii) Proceedings under the "guillotine" are in progress, the proceedings shall be completed.
(3) The Speaker shall propose the question "That Private Members' Statements be noted"
(4) Up to 16 Members may speak for up to 5 minutes each and replies by Ministers shall be limited to 2 minutes each.
(5) Private Members' Statements may be taken between items of business with the leave of the House for a specified period or a specified number of Members or until certain business is to be conducted as notified by the Minister in charge of the House at that time.
(6) A division on any question or quorum call shall not be permitted during Private Members' Statements.
(7) At the conclusion of Private Members' Statements on Thursday and Friday the House shall adjourn without motion moved until the next sitting day.

CONSIDERATION OF MOTIONS ACCORDED PRIORITYCONSIDERATION OF MOTIONS ACCORDED PRIORITY

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 109 shall be read as follows:

109. The procedure for the consideration of motions accorded priority shall be as follows:

(1) Prior to Question Time on Tuesday and Wednesday the Speaker shall ask if there are any written notices of motions to be accorded priority over the other business of the House.
(2) No more than two notices shall be accepted at any one sitting of the House.
(3) The notices shall be set down for consideration later in the sitting in accordance with the routine of business.
(4) (a) The Members giving the notices shall each be permitted to make statements of up to 5 minutes as to why their notice should be accorded priority.
(b) At the conclusion of the 5 minute statements the Speaker shall put the question on the first notice "That the motion of the Member for be accorded priority".
(c) If this motion is carried the Member may proceed.
(d) If the motion is not carried the question "That the motion of the Member for be accorded priority" is then put on the next motion.
(5) When the motion for priority is determined and the motion is moved, the following time limits shall apply:
Mover - 10 minutes
Member next speaking - 10 minutes
Other Members
(limited the three) - 5 minutes
Reply - 5 minutes

MATTERS OF PUBLIC IMPORTANCEMATTERS OF PUBLIC IMPORTANCE

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 110 shall be read as follows:

110. The procedure for matters of public importance is as follows:

(1) The matter, which must be definite, shall be handed in writing to the Speaker no later than 12.00 noon on days when the House discusses a Matter of Public Importance and immediately published.
(2) The Speaker, in the event that more than one matter is submitted, shall determine which matter is of the greatest public importance.
(3) At least 30 minutes prior to the time for Question Time -
(d) the Premier, the Leader of the Opposition, the responsible Minister in the House, Members submitting matters and the Independent Members shall be informed in writing by the Speaker of the matter determined by the Speaker to be discussed.
(e) the Speaker, by placing a notice on notice boards, shall inform Members of the matter.
(4) If the Speaker decides that any matter proposed is in order it shall be announced to the House by the Speaker.
(5) As provided in the routine of business the Speaker shall call the Member concerned to proceed with the matter. The matter cannot be amended.
(6) The following time limit shall apply:
Member submitting the matter 15 minutes
Member next speaking 15 minutes
Four other Members 5 minutes
Member concluding the discussion 10 minutes
(7) Where a motion accorded priority has been considered by the House then any Matter of Public Importance listed for discussion that day shall be limited in duration to the following speaking times:
Mover 10 minutes
Member next speaking 10 minutes
One other Member 5 minutes
Reply 5 minutes
(8) At the conclusion of the discussion no question shall be put.
(9) There shall be no dissent from the ruling of the Speaker in relation to the operation of this Standing Order.

NO CONFIDENCE IN GOVERNMENTNO CONFIDENCE IN GOVERNMENT

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 111 shall be read as follows:

111. The procedure for motions of no confidence in the Government is as follows:

(1) A notice of motion must be given.
(2) If a motion is given under section 24B(2) of the Constitution Act 1902, it shall take precedence of all other business on a sitting day that is not less than 3 clear days after the notice has been given.
(3) The motion may not be postponed or amended.
(4) The motion may be withdrawn with the leave of the House.
(5) Debate on such motion shall not be adjourned and the sitting of the House shall continue until the question is determined.
(6) The following time limits apply to this debate:
Mover unspecified
Party Leader unspecified
Any other Member 30 minutes
Premier in response 45 minutes
Reply 45 minutes
(7) The following motions cannot be moved:
That the Member be now heard.
That the Member be not further heard.
That the question be not now put (previous question).
(8) The motion "That the question be now put" (closure) cannot be moved until at least 8 Members (inclusive of the mover and Party Leader(s)) have spoken to the original question before the House. The effect of the closure being agreed to does not preclude the response of the Premier.
(9) During the currency of the debate the Speaker shall leave the Chair at the time for adjournment each day and the sitting shall resume at 10.00 a.m. on each successive business day until the matter is determined.
(10) When the question is determined the Speaker shall adjourn the House without motion moved until the next sitting day.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 112 shall be read as follows:

112. The procedure for a motion of no confidence in a Minister is as follows:

(1) A notice of motion must be given.
(2) Such notice shall take place of and be called upon in the place of the Matter of Public Importance in the routine of business at the next sitting day on which such matters are considered.
(3) On any day when such notices are set down, the House cannot consider Matters of Public Importance.
(4) The motion may not be postponed or amended.
(5) The motion may be withdrawn with the leave of the House.
(6) Debate will be as follows:
Mover unspecified
Minister named unspecified
Any other Member 20 minutes
Response by Minister - 30 minutes
Mover in reply 30 minutes
(7) The following motions cannot be moved:
That the Member be now heard.
That the Member be not further heard.
That the question be not now put (previous question).
(8) The motion "That the question be now put" (closure) cannot be moved until at least 4 Members (inclusive of the Mover and Minister named) have spoken on the original question before the House. The effect of the closure being agreed to does not preclude the response by the Minister named.

NO CONFIDENCE IN SPEAKERNO CONFIDENCE IN SPEAKER

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 113 shall be read as follows:

113. The procedure for a motion of no confidence in the Speaker is as follows:

(1) A notice of motion must be given.
(2) Such notice shall take place of and be called upon in the place of the Matter of Public Importance in the routine of business at the next sitting day on which such matters are considered.
(3) On any day when such notices are set down, the House cannot consider Matters of Public Importance.
(4) The motion may not be postponed or amended.
(5) The motion may be withdrawn with the leave of the House.
(6) Debate will be as follows:
Mover unspecified
Member leading the debate in
opposition to the motion unspecified
Any other Member 20 minutes
Response by Member leading
the debate in opposition to
the motion 30 minutes
Mover in reply 30 minutes
(7) The following motions cannot be moved:
That the Member be now heard.
That the Member be not further heard.
That the question be not now put (previous question).
(8) The motion "That the question be now put" (closure) cannot be moved until at least 4 Members (inclusive of the mover and Member leading the debate in opposition to the motion) have spoken on the original question before the House. The effect of the closure being agreed to does not preclude the response by the Member leading the debate in opposition to the motion.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 114 shall be read as follows:

114. The procedure for a motion of censure of a Member is as follows:

(1) A notice of motion must be given.
(2) Such notice shall take the place of and be called upon in the place of the Matter of Public Importance in the routine of business on the same sitting day at which the notice was given, except on Thursday when the notice shall be called on at the next sitting Tuesday in place of the Matter of Public Importance in the routine of business.
(3) Debate will be as follows:
Mover 15 minutes
Member named 15 minutes
Four other Members 5 minutes
Response by Member 10 minutes
Mover in reply 10 minutes
(4) The following motions cannot be moved:
That the Member be now heard.
That the Member be not further heard.
That the question be not now put (previous question).
(5) The motion "That the question be now put" (closure) cannot be moved until at least 4 Members (inclusive of the Mover and Member named) have spoken on the original question before the House. The effect of the closure being agreed to does not preclude the response of the Member named.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 115 shall be read as follows:

115. The procedure for a motion of censure of a Member is as follows:
(1) A notice of motion must be given.
(2) Such notice shall take the place of and be called upon in the place of the Matter of Public Importance on the same sitting day at which the notice was given, except on Thursday when the notice shall be called on at the next sitting Tuesday in the place of the Matter of Public Importance in the routine of business.
(3) Debate will be as follows:
Mover 15 minutes
Member leading the debate
in opposition to the motion 15 minutes
Four other Members 5 minutes
Response by Member leading
the debate in opposition to
the motion 10 minutes
Mover in reply 10 minutes
(4) The following motions cannot be moved:
That the Member be now heard.
That the Member be not further heard.
That the question be not now put (previous question).
(5) The motion "That the question be now put" (closure) cannot be moved until at least 4 Members (inclusive of the Mover and Member leading the debate in opposition to the motion) have spoken on the original question before the House. The effect of the closure being agreed to does not preclude the response of the Member leading the debate in opposition to the motion.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 132 shall be read as follows:

132. The procedure for written questions is as follows:

(1) Questions shall be handed to one of the Clerks at the Table or lodged in the Procedure Office by 12.00 noon.
(2) A question containing argument, unbecoming expressions or otherwise not conforming with the practice of the House may:
(a) Under the authority of the Speaker, be amended by the Clerk or divided if it contains matters that are not relevant to each other.
(b) Be ordered not to be printed by the Speaker or removed from the Questions and Answers Paper.
(3) The number of questions able to be lodged accumulative over one sitting week are:
(a) Members – three questions per sitting day
(b) Leader of the Opposition – four questions per sitting day.
(4) Ministers shall lodge answers to written questions within 35 calendar days after the question is first published. On sitting days answers must be submitted by 12.00 noon on the due date, to be published in the next sitting day's paper. Any answers lodged after this time will be published at a subsequent time. Answers must be signed and lodged in hard copy and also electronically.

(5) If an answer to a written question is not received within 35 calendar days the Speaker, at the next sitting day after the expiry date, shall forthwith inform the House and the Minister shall immediately explain to the House the reason for non-compliance.
(6) If the Minister, after explanation in the House, has not submitted an answer within 3 sitting days the Speaker shall again inform the House and the Minister shall again be called to explain with such procedure continuing until a written answer is submitted.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 133 shall be read as follows:

133.
(1) A notice of motion for:
(a) A bill;
(b) Government Business;
(c) No confidence in the Government, Minister or Speaker, or censure of Member or Speaker;
(d) Business with Precedence, (SO 118) with the exception of votes of thanks or condolence; and
(e) A General Notice to be the subject of a motion for re-ordering
must be given verbally at the time prescribed in the routine of business and show the date for moving the motion.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 184 shall be read as follows:

184. In the event of an equality of votes, the Member presiding shall give a casting vote and any reasons given may be recorded in the Votes and Proceedings.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 251 shall be read as follows:

251. If the Member has been named:

(1) The Speaker shall forthwith propose the question "That the Member for be suspended from the service of the House"
(2) There shall be no amendment, adjournment or debate allowed on this motion. However, the Member named may make an explanation limited to 5 minutes.

That, during the current session, unless otherwise ordered, Standing Order 306 shall be read as follows:

306.
(1) The report and associated documents of any committee (not being a legislation committee) shall be presented at the time provided in the routine of business, or at any other time with the leave of the House.
(2) The Member presenting the report may move "That the document be printed". This question shall be decided without debate or amendment.
(3) Reports from committees shall stand in the order in which they are presented (or reported by the Clerk when received during an adjournment) as orders of the day "That the House take note of the Report".
(4) Such orders of the day may be considered between 1.00 p.m. and 1.30 p.m. on Fridays. Any interrupted item of business shall stand as an order of the day for tomorrow.
(5) When the order of the day is called on and not proceeded with, consideration of the report shall be postponed until the next Friday sitting when reports are considered. If the order of the day is called on at that subsequent sitting and is not proceeded with, the question shall be put.
(6) If a committee has more than one report on the Business Paper the Chair or Member who tabled the report may move a motion without notice, amendment or debate to facilitate the consideration of two or more of the committee's reports together.
(7) The Member tabling the report may speak for up to 10 minutes and any other Member may speak for up to 5 minutes to the question "That the House take note of the Report" with the question being put after 30 minutes. No reply is permitted.
(8) Orders of the day not commenced or not completed 12 months from the date of tabling shall lapse.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI (Murrumbidgee) [3.17 p.m.]: Some discussion has taken place about changes to the sessional orders. The new sessional orders that I have seen potentially will be used to implement what has become known as the family friendly hours. The Opposition does not agree with a number of the proposed changes to the sessional orders. For example, we do not agree with the proposal that debate on motions to be accorded priority will not take place on Thursdays. We do not support members of the Opposition and Government backbenchers being denied the opportunity to raise and debate issues of priority. That is a denial of a right of members of Parliament on both sides of the House.

The Opposition is also concerned about an issue when the House sits on Fridays. It has always been the Liberals-Nationals position, I am sure supported by the crossbenchers, that we should have question time on Friday. When Parliament sits we want question time. The Government introduced Friday sittings so that it did not look as lazy as it is. The Government listed Fridays so it could say it was sitting 55 or 60 days a year. In fact, this year the House has had question time on 36 days. Question time is the key time for Parliament. It is the opportunity for Opposition members to ask Government members questions about the way they handle their portfolios.

The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Manly will cease interjecting.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: Question time is also an opportunity for Government backbenchers to ask those tough questions of their own Government members about how they handle their portfolios. I shall move a number of amendments to the proposed sessional orders that have been introduced today. First, I refer to Standing Order 98, Question Time on Fridays. I move:

That proposed sessional order "Friday Sittings" be amended by leaving out paragraph (2) and adding after paragraph (4):

(5) At 2.15 p.m. Question Time be conducted.

By way of explanation, proposed Standing Order 98 (2) states:

No quorums or divisions on Fridays.

On election to Parliament, we on this side of the House are paid our salaries to appear in Parliament to debate legislation. If the Government has run out of Government business, there is plenty of private members' business on the notice paper to be dealt with. The Opposition wants quorums and divisions on Fridays. The Opposition believes that on Fridays there needs to be a question time for the reasons I have given. My second amendment relates to relevance. Everyone knows about the standing order that relates to relevance, Standing Order 129. I believe that even a couple of members on the Government side now understand what that standing order means. My amendment relates to Standing Order 129 and adds the word "directly" prior to the word "relevant", so that Minister's answers must be directly relevant to the question. I move:

That Standing Order 129 be amended by inserting the word "directly" immediately prior to the word "relevant".

As a result of this amendment, Minister's answers will have to be directly relevant to the question. That is a terrific idea, a terrific amendment, but I cannot take credit for it. Members would be shocked to know whose suggestion it was. It was actually Paul Whelan's suggestionhe is a former member for Strathfieldand it was fully supported by the member for Riverstone, John Aquilina. The vast resources of the Oppositionthe seven staff membershave trawled through Hansard. They do terrific work—

Ms Linda Burney: Who are they?

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: I advise the Minister for Fair Trading that there are seven of them, as opposed to her multimillion dollar hoardthe 33 or 36 of themthat sit outside the Chamber during question time. Our hardworking Opposition staff have trawled through Hansard and this is what they found: On 13 October 1994 Mr John Aquilina, the member for Riverstone, referring to the standing order applying to relevanceat that time Standing Order 78said:

It is absurd that the word "relevant" in Standing Order 78 has absolutely no consequence upon the requirement for a Minister to keep his answer strictly relevant to the question asked. My colleague the honourable member for Ashfield has sought to add the word "directly" before the word "relevant" to give the Speaker greater guidance in terms of relevancy.

I cannot say that the member for Riverstone has said much of interest in the nine months since the State election; he has not said much to excite us on the Opposition benches. We know he is upset at not being the Speaker. He has been sacked from every position he ever held in Parliament. But this is the one time that we will agree wholeheartedly with the member for Riverstone. It is 13 years later, but his campaign can finally come to fruition today, to add the word "directly"—

The SPEAKER: Order! I will interrupt the member for Murrumbidgee, although I am loath to do so because his contribution is very entertaining. The proposed sessional orders do not include any change to Standing Order 129, which the member for Murrumbidgee referred to. However, the first part of the amendment relates to question time on Friday and the proposed sessional orders relate to Friday sittings. I ask the member for Murrumbidgee to confine his comments to the proposed sessional orders that are contained in the document. A list is available, and Standing Order 129 is not on the agenda.

Mr Barry O'Farrell: Point of order: As all members opposite know, because of the way in which the branches operate, when a member seeks to amend a motion words can be deleted and a member can seek to insert additional provisions. That is what we do every day when debating priority motions. We seek to add additional clauses to motions.

The SPEAKER: But the amendment has to be relevant to a motion before the House.

Mr Barry O'Farrell: Yes, Mr Speaker, but—

The SPEAKER: Order! I am responding to the point of order. The motion lists all of the standing orders that will be amended; it is similar to a bill. Standing Order 129 is not on the agenda. There are other processes available to amend standing orders that are not listed on the document.

Mr Barry O'Farrell: The member for Murrumbidgee is seeking to introduce a new sessional order into that document, in the same way that the House occasionally seeks to introduce new clauses into legislation.

The SPEAKER: Order! If members wish to avail themselves of other processes to introduce changes to standing orders that are not listed in the document, I would be happy to receive any such motion.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: Mr Speaker, can I add a sessional order?

The SPEAKER: Let me hear what you have to say.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: I seek to add a sessional order that reads:

An answer shall be directly relevant to the question asked.

My amendment is that we add a sessional order, whatever number it will be as the last sessional order in the standing orders.

The SPEAKER: Order! I have been advised that the motion is out of order because the amendment is not directly relevant to the motion before the House. I do not believe members want to debate dozens of amendments that are not proposed in the motion.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: The sessional orders we have do not relate only to the family friendly hours that you, Mr Speaker, have discussed previously with Government members and Opposition members. The sessional orders that the Government is seeking to introduce today are much broader than just family friendly hours. They relate to plenty of other things, including the election of Speaker and participation in proceedings, absence of the Speaker, daily publications of House papers, timing of bells. They do not all relate to changes in family friendly hours. None are relevant to each other. I do not see how an amendment along the lines that I am proposing is somehow less relevant than in any other standing orders. Mr Speaker, you are receiving terrible advice here on the last day. Members are entitled to vote down my proposed amendment.

The SPEAKER: Order! I do not know how many sessional orders are listed for discussion; it could be about 20. I am happy to receive amendments relating to those matters and to listen to discussion about them. I will rule anything else out of order. If the member for Murrumbidgee wants to use another process, which he is entitled to do under the standing orders, I will allow that. However, what he proposes to do is not appropriate at this time. The member will address the proposed sessional orders.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: The sessional orders refer to changes in proceedings in the House, including question time. On the first day that this House sat there was much talk and there was subsequently much discussion in the media about the need for answers to be relevant. Mr Speaker, you took that up as a personal challenge; that you would make this House much more accountable and much more relevant. The Government is trying, and that was reinforced by Mr Speaker's ruling, to deny the public of New South Wales the right to answers in question time. The Leader of the House supported these changes in 1994. I have never seen an amendment such as this ruled out of order. All I am proposing to do is exactly what Mr Speaker and others said on the very first day this House would be done, and as has been widely reported in the media.

The fact that this amendment will not be allowed is doing the Government's business of denying the Opposition, the crossbenchers and the public of New South Wales the right to get some answers in this House. The way Government members respond to questions is a complete joke. The Leader of the House knew about it in 1994 and tried to do something about it; we were trying to do something about it—and he supported it—and now we are being denied that opportunity. This House will continue to be a joke unless that change is made.

Mr Michael Daley: Point of order: I draw the attention of the member for Murrumbidgee to Standing Order No. 95, which provides a very clear process for dissenting from the ruling of a Speaker. You have made your ruling and the member for Murrumbidgee is clearly continuing to canvass your ruling. He is transgressing Standing Order No. 95.

The SPEAKER: Order! I have ruled in relation to this matter. If the member for Murrumbidgee wishes to move an amendment by way of substantive motion or notice of motion to any of the sessional orders not listed in the document, there are processes available to him to do that and I will happily accept any such amendment. However, we cannot do that here today. That is not a political proposition; it is the process I have been advised should be followed. I ask the member for Murrumbidgee to confine his remarks to the proposed sessional orders, and there are many of them to choose from.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: I move the following amendment:

That proposed sessional order "Routine of Business" be amended by adding after item 14 under "General Business Days" the following:

15. Motion Accorded Priority.

That amendment relates to the proposed ridiculous changes to the parliamentary schedule. We on the Opposition side support business hours and parliamentary sitting hours that are much more in line with community expectations and standards, business community standards and the standards of all the hardworking people in our electorates. It is absurd that on some days this House sits until 1.00 a.m. and the upper House until 3.00 a.m., but what we do not accept is a denial of our rights and the opportunity to speak in this House on matters that the Government does not want to hear about. Question time is a joke and now the Government is trying to deny the Opposition the opportunity on a Thursday to raise issues that should be accorded priority. That is why we do not support the changes.

The SPEAKER: What is the specific section within that that you are seeking to amend?

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: Standing Order 97.

The SPEAKER: What are you seeking to say?

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: That on General Business days motions accorded priority be included. I apologise that these amendments were handwritten in the space of 10 minutes or so. Because of the disrespect of the Government—particularly the Leader of the House—which lacks any sense of etiquette or politeness, the Opposition was given a wad of sessional orders to consider about two-thirds of the way into question time. Mr Speaker, I know the Whips have had discussions with you about changes to the family-friendly hours, but they were the only changes proposed. One of the other changes is that in the absence of the Speaker, the Deputy-Speaker, Assistant-Speakers and Acting-Speakers, the Clerks should take over the role of Speaker. Why are all these people being paid all this money? The Speaker and the Deputy-Speaker are paid additional money for their roles. Two Assistant-Speakers were appointed earlier this year with additional salaries. What are they doing if they are all going to be absent and one of the Clerks is going to have to step in and take over the duties of the Speaker?

That is what the Government has done with these sessional orders. If I sound unhappy about it and unhappy with your ruling, that is largely to do with it. Do not tell me the Government just drafted this motion and had the opportunity to present it to the Opposition only at three o'clock in the afternoon. The Government probably had it for a few hours and gave it to us at the last minute. I apologise to you and to the Clerks for the handwritten amendments I propose but if this Parliament could return to a sense of proper decorum, etiquette and politeness—the sorts of things that would make the general public feel proud of the New South Wales Parliament—I would be more than happy with that. But while the Labor Party is in government and while the member for Riverstone is the Leader of the House—he has got a terrible record in his time in Parliament of being a complete grub. If grubs were cows the Government could open a dairy on that side of the House.

Mr John Aquilina: Point of order

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: I am pleased to have completed my contribution.

Mr John Aquilina: I take offence to the honourable member's statement and I ask him to withdraw it.

The SPEAKER: Order! I ask the member for Murrumbidgee to withdraw that statement.

Mr ADRIAN PICCOLI: I withdraw it.

The SPEAKER: Order! The easiest way to deal with this is to take the two amendments that have been proposed to the sessional orders and simply put the question—

Mr Barry O'Farrell: Are you stopping debate?

The SPEAKER: Order! I am not stopping debate. I will accept the two amendments moved by the member for Murrumbidgee and simply put the question on those amendments. I will hear one or two contributions, but I do not think we should be here debating this matter all night. Some debate on this matter is appropriate.

Mr Chris Hartcher: Point of order: This is a notice of motion; you cannot close off debate.

The SPEAKER: There are amendments.

Mr Chris Hartcher: It is a notice of motion before the House. There is a general debate upon the subject. The question is as moved by the Leader of the House and the member for Murrumbidgee has moved amendments, and there is now a general debate.

The SPEAKER: That is what I am saying. I will now call for further contributions.

Mr ALAN ASHTON (East Hills) [3.36 p.m.]: I just want to make one comment. In the case of the absence of the Speaker, the shadow Leader of the House said that the Clerk would run the House. I point out that Standing Order No. 18 says:

Absence of Speaker, Deputy Speaker and Assistant Speaker during session

If the Speaker, Deputy Speaker and Assistant Speaker are all absent when the House is sitting, the Clerk shall inform the House, which shall, upon motion without notice, before any further business is conducted, proceed to the election of an Acting Speaker and:

(1) The Clerk shall preside for the election of an Acting Speaker

There is no intention for the Clerk to run the House.

The SPEAKER: Order! That is a valid point. The Clerk, as is standard in many organisations and parliaments, assumes the Chair when a ballot is conducted.

Mr BARRY O'FARRELL (Ku-ring-gai—Leader of the Opposition) [3.37 p.m.]: Mr Speaker, you launched a book a month ago. I note that the two sections relating to sessional orders disagree with the ruling that was given in relation to the member for Murrumbidgee. We need to understand the history of what are described as family-friendly hours, but let us be blunt about it: the only reason this has come about is because the Parliament has been subjected to the same sorts of budget cuts as has the rest of the New South Wales public sector. Mr Speaker, you have found a way to try to work within the budget handed to you by Treasurer Costa. The Premier immediately released that proposal to the media as so-called family-friendly hours coming into the Parliament. That needs to be said upfront because these proposals are as far from family-friendly as the existing sittings of Parliament. We should go to the heart of this matter. When the Premier announced the proposal he did not announce we were going to have family-friendly hours; he announced we were going to have a committee.

Once again, the Premier is incapable of making a decision, even on small things that relate to the running of this House. He is unable to make a decision and, as a result, you have worked with Whips and managers of Opposition business and Government business and all those things to try to get a set of proposals together. As you know, Mr Speaker, you have been stymied every step of the way in relation to those negotiations. You have done your bestyou have put together a compromise proposal and, like most compromises, it is neither fish nor fowl. As a result, we have got an unsatisfactory set of proposals and we are having an unsatisfactory debate. I say to the member for Sydney that this would not have occurred under the Parliament in which she had the balance of power.

Just so that everyone knows how bad that statement is, I inform the House that I was never in support of the member for Sydney and her cohorts having the balance of power. However, in relation to this matter the member for Sydney would not have allowed this to go forward because it lacks any sense of accountability that is meant to be at the heart of this process. We have had 28 Premiers of New South Wales and, for all but two of them, whenever Parliament sat there was a question time, but under Bob Carr and Morris Iemma we now have Friday sittings, what I describe as batting average sittings—the sitting days you have simply to get up the number of days you are supposed to sit.

The Premier was on radio this morning telling untruths to Mike and Fitz. He said there are 63 sitting days next year. The reality is that there will be only 48 sitting days next year on which there will be question time, 48 sitting days that are understood to be parliamentary sitting days by the people who framed the Federal Constitution and the State Constitution. We have had 35 sitting days this year on which there have been question times. The Daily Telegraph got it wrong today because it assumed that our first sitting day, a Tuesday in May, had a question time. That, of course, was the ceremonial day. We have had Friday sittings after Friday sittings with no question time—sittings that have not added to the accountability of this place. They are a joke. On four of those days we sat for less than two hours. On six days we sat for less than three hours. It is like scheduling a day for a test match and telling the bowlers they cannot take on the batsmen. It is nonsense, it is absurd, and it is all about protecting this embarrassing Government from its appalling record when it comes to the running of this place.

Not only can the Government not get legislation into this place at the start of a session, but at the end of a session this democratic institution resembles a sausage factory. Bills are pushed through at such a pace that, like those sausages, no one has any idea what they contain. The only certainty is that next week we will come back and face amendment bill after amendment bill to clean up the mess created by the way in which legislation has been rammed through this place in the dying days of this session. People outside the Chamber do not understand that when it comes to question time—a process that is fundamental—the State Opposition gets five questions on the first sitting Tuesday, five on the first sitting Wednesday and four on the first sitting Thursday; then in the next week it gets five on the second Tuesday, four on the second Wednesday and four on the second Thursday.

This is a State Government so scared of accountability, so scared of an Opposition on which it tries to pour scorn day in and day out, that it will not allow us to have question time on a Friday. It should be a matter that is fundamental to the operation of this place. What is it that the Government is trying to hide that it will not have question time on a Friday? The member for Heffron would happily welcome question time on Fridays. It would give her an opportunity to stake her claim for the premiership of New South Wales. It would answer the question for the New South Wales Right of the Labor Party. Do we really have to put up with a Lefty as Premier? The member for Heffron does not fear question time because she is so much better than Reba Meagher, Frank Sartor and the others. But those opposite fear it because Morris Iemma does not like the process.

I have no doubt that the motions moved by the member for Murrumbidgee should be supported by all members of this House. They simply seek to allow on future Thursdays what currently happens, which is for an urgency motion to continue. It might also have been widened to include a matter of public importance, but we know that on most Thursdays we do not get to the matters of public importance. It should be supported to allow the addition of question time to sitting Fridays. If that is not going to happen, the Leader of the House—and perhaps the Minister and anyone else—should get up here and explain why Parliament should not have question time on a day when it sits.

What you know, Mr Speaker, and what the public should know is that the process the Premier started was to deliver what he described as family friendly hours to the Parliament of New South Wales. Once again it is not about the wider family; it is about the Labor family. It is about looking after the Labor Party, not looking after the public interest. What we know is that the so-called family friendly hours being promoted less than six weeks ago by the Premier will apply to this House, but there is no agreement yet for the other House. In fact, as I understand it, senior Ministers in the other House are quite distressed that they might have to travel on Sydney streets during peak hour, as the rest of the commuters across Sydney do. Mr Speaker, you know for a fact that so far there is no guarantee that these changes will deliver the budget cuts that you are being forced to meet because there is no agreement from members of the upper House at this stage that they will adapt their hours, and if there is no agreement by the upper House we really do have a dog's breakfast because Hansard will have to continue to attend, all the other parliamentary staff will have to be here, and the so called savings that you are trying to find because the pressure is put upon you by Michael Costa simply will not be found.

This is another dog's breakfast of the State Government's making, born out of the incapacity of our Premier to ever make a decision. Have a committee, and when you have a committee, stack it with people who are opposed to the proposal you want to have. Use that to mask another attempt to deny this Chamber its democratic right to question the Government during question time, to debate priority motions, to draw attention to this Government's failures—and frankly there are not enough days for us to do that—and to introduce a standing order that will finally enable Ministers opposite, of whichever party, to answer questions relevantly. We continue to see, from the Minister for Community Services at the bottom of the tree all the way up to the Deputy Premier, Ministers who cannot answer a question without reading every word. It does not matter whether the question comes from the Government side or from our side.

There is no relevance, and that is why we need to support the amendments moved by the member for Murrumbidgee, why we need to remember where these proposals were born, why we need to support you in your efforts to stand up to the Treasurer of New South Wales in what he is trying to do to the Parliament. I noticed, Mr Speaker, that in your letter to the Premier about these hours you made the point about the Opposition's rejection of the absence of question time on Friday. Your letter made the point about our concern about the loss of the priority motion on a Thursday. I have no doubt that you wanted to write in that letter also that you supported the idea of a standing or sessional order that included relevance when it came to answering questions. Can I congratulate the Whips of the Coalition for trying to deal with this matter in a rational way in a very irrational committee put together by a Premier who cannot make decisions, a Premier who always looks for excuses to run away from problems—

Mr Gerard Martin: Boring repetition—sit down.

Mr BARRY O'FARRELL: And it is no different here, Bundy, on this issue, than it was—

Mr Gerard Martin: Boring repetition.

Mr BARRY O'FARRELL: The member for Bathurst—and I will not use the language used by the member for Murrumbidgee—is the most ignorant man in this Chamber.

The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Bathurst will cease interjecting.

Mr BARRY O'FARRELL: His ignorance spreads like a blanket across this Chamber with barely a hole in it and it is about time that he shut up.

Mr Gerard Martin: Boring repetition. Fat and useless.

Mr BARRY O'FARRELL: I acknowledge that interjection, that "fat and useless" interjection by the stupid member opposite.

The SPEAKER: Order! I ask members to calm down. I ask the member for Sydney to make her contribution.

Ms CLOVER MOORE (Sydney) [3.48 p.m.]: I want to make a contribution to this debate because I want to comment on the way the Parliament is being run in this term. I would like to congratulate both the Government and the Opposition in supporting the election of an Independent Speaker. Every other way this Parliament is being run I am really very concerned about. I would like to remind members that if the Government does not treat members of Parliament with respect in terms of being able to represent their constituents, if the Government treats members of Parliament with contempt, the Government is treating the constituents of those members with contempt.

I believe that is what we are seeing in this Parliament. I have been an Independent member for a remarkable 20 years. At one stage the then member for South Coast, the then member for Manly and I held the balance of power. We radically reformed the processes of this place for the benefit of the people of New South Wales and members of this Parliament. It is because of that reform process that we have the urgency debate—which is now called the priority debate—10 questions during question time or 45 minutes of questions, estimate committees, legislation committees and, for the first time, the Parliament adjourning at 10.30 p.m. rather than sitting ridiculous hours all through the night. We also ensured that members were given the program on Fridays.

Most people in New South Wales would think that the Parliament is run like a business and that members know what is happening and that they can plan their lives and prepare worthwhile contributions to the development of legislation and the welfare of the people of New South Wales. Most sitting days we are lucky if we get the program by the time the House sits. Prior to the reform charter, ordinary legislation had to lie on the table for five days and, if it was significant legislation, for 28 days. A legislation committee would be established, there would be debate, discussion with specialists in the relevant topic and constituents would be consulted. I admire the contribution made last night by the member for Epping on legislation that has great ramifications for the people of New South Wales in terms of extending powers that were introduced on a temporary basis after the Cronulla riots. The Minister introduced the legislation and it was on the table for less than five minutes before the debate commenced. And that is significant legislation.

I am appalled about the way this Parliament is being run. A reading of today's newspapers would not suggest that State Parliament is sitting or that any of this significant legislation is being rushed through. Our constituents will eventually find out what has gone through this House—as limited as that has been this year compared with previous years. I am appalled about the way the Parliament is being run, that we do not get programs, that we do not know what is happening and that the timetable keeps changing. We plan our lives, work and contributions, but there is no opportunity to participate in the intelligent way that our constituents expect. The fact that this motion has been moved now is typical of the sloppy management of this Parliament. I am very disappointed and I hope the situation improves next year. This is the worst performance I have seen in 20 years.

Mr ANDREW FRASER (Coffs Harbour—Deputy Leader of The Nationals) [3.54 p.m.]: I draw the attention of the House to Standing Order 364, which states:

The House may from time to time adopt sessional orders which shall have effect for the duration of the session, unless otherwise ordered.

In the 17 years that I have been a member of the place the convention has always been that the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee meets to discuss the standing orders. The Leader of the Opposition, the member for Myall Lakes and I were members of that Standing Orders and Procedure Committee a long time ago. Paul Whelan convened a meeting of the committee in the Speaker's dining room one evening, but it was interrupted and was never reconvened. We knew the standing orders needed to be upgraded and we were called together prior to this session and were handed the new standing orders. Funnily, the standing orders that we have now adopted—which the member for Myall Lakes, the Leader of the Opposition and I tried to amend, especially in relation to truthful answers—

Mr Barry O'Farrell: They objected to that one, too.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: Yes, that amendment was rejected. The Leader of the Opposition wanted some truth in Ministers' answers in this place. We were told that it was question time and not answer time. We are all used to that now; we ask questions but do not get answers. The committee was given an opportunity to examine the new standing orders presented to it. However, they were written by the member for Liverpool and they were not open for discussion or debate. That committee is a committee of this House and it should decide in a bipartisan manner how this House should be run. The committee was not given the opportunity to add to or comment on the new standing orders. As I said, when we did try to amend them to require truthful answers from Ministers, the Government rejected our amendment.

Today we were given a set of standing orders that we all assumed had come from the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee. However, I checked the situation with our Whip. I was told that the current committee members are the member for Myall Lakes, the member for Wagga Wagga and the member for Lismore. The only discussion they have had about the standing orders was with you, Mr Speaker, not as members of the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee but as representatives of their respective parties, and the discussion was about the so-called family friendly hours. The proposed sessional orders, which amend the standing orders, as put to us today have not been seen by the Coalition's appointed representatives. We were given these sessional orders halfway through question time so that we could make an informed decision. When the member for Murrumbidgee and shadow Leader of the House had a quick look at them—

Mr Adrian Piccoli: They are sessional orders.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: Yes, they are sessional orders, but they amend the standing orders. The member for Murrumbidgee had to hand write an amendment and he was advised by the Clerks that an amendment to particular standing orders within the sessional orders would not be accepted. Is this House and are the sessional orders the property of the members or of an elite group? I wonder whether you, Mr Speaker, are a member of any group that formulated these sessional orders. Are the standing orders the property of members or the Leader of the House and the Government?

We have limited access to democracy and equity in this Chamber. That opportunity is provided by the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee, which is delegated by us as party members on both sides of the House to address the standing orders. If a standing or sessional order needs to be amended—as has been done today, the last sitting day until the end of February—those amendments must be scrutinised by that committee. It is patently obvious that these sessional orders have been thrust upon us today without reference to that committee. Mr Speaker, I strongly disagree with the advice given to you by the Clerk today. Since Labor assumed power in this State the Opposition has rarely been consulted about the standing and sessional orders.

The Opposition has presented a considered amendment. The House should vote on this amendment because the motion deals with the election of the Speaker and participation in proceedings; the absence of the Speaker, Deputy Speaker, Assistant Speaker and Temporary Speakers; daily publication of House papers; timing of bells; adjournment and next morning; routine of business; Friday sittings; program for general business days; general business notices of motions and private members' statements; consideration of motions accorded priority; matters of public importance; no confidence in the Government; no confidence in a Minister; no confidence in the Speaker; censure of a member; censure of the Speaker; written questions; notices of motions; the Speaker's casting vote; the procedure after naming; and tabling in the House and debate.

Surely this document should at least have been given to each member or to the nominated representatives on the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee so that we could consider it in its entirety. It may have typing mistakes. The last document of this type contained a large number of mistakes and a great deal of work had to be done by the Clerks between the first and last drafts. We have no assurance that what we are being asked to adopt today is in an acceptable form. If that is so, in the interests of democracy and of each and every member, as the member for Sydney said, so that we can represent our constituents properly and fairly, this document should be left on the table so that we can discuss it as members of our respective committees, as individuals, as parties and as a Coalition.

Mrs Jillian Skinner: And with our constituents.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: As the Deputy Leader of the Opposition said, we can discuss it with our constituents if need be, and come back to this place in February next year for an informed debate. We each need hellishly more than 20 minutes to go through each change, compare it to the existing standing order and make a decision. That is what the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee was designed to do. We knew we did not have the numbers on the committee. I am sure that way back in 1994 when the member for Riverstone moved the amendment relating to the relevance of answers to questions he understood that maybe Labor did not have the numbers. We need the opportunity to consider these changes in the knowledge that the committee has discussed them fully. It is beyond me how these sessional orders could be adopted today by this House without allowing us full scrutiny.

Mr Jonathan O'Dea: Outrageous.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: It is outrageous. How we could adopt these changes is beyond me. I guarantee that not every member on the other side of the House has seen them. I am sure crossbench members have not seen them. Maybe the member for Liverpool, the Minister for Local Government, has seen them because he stuck his nose in when he was not a member of the committee and rewrote a lot of them. I am still suspicious of some of the changes he made.

Mr Paul Lynch: You are not capable of reading them, are you?

Mr ANDREW FRASER: Well, not capable of giving them full consideration today.

The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Coffs Harbour will make his contribution through the Chair.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: I am not capable of giving them full consideration in the time frame we have been allowed today. I do not believe that most members even realised that the changes had been tabled until the motion was put after question time. We were waiting for the moving of a motion to be accorded priority. This motion to change the sessional orders was not on today's agenda. Developing changes to sessional orders in a star chamber is not what democracy is about. It is undemocratic for the Clerks to advise that a standing order cannot be amended when this motion proposes to amend 16 or 17 standing orders. The Clerk of the Legislative Assembly, Mr Grove, has erred considerably by not informing the Coalition and the crossbench of these proposed amendments prior to them being laid on the table of this House. For him not to do so shows that he is not a Clerk of the Parliament, he is a Clerk of the Government. That is not the way the Westminster system has operated. We should have confidence in being able to seek advice from the Clerk. Yet when we seek to move an amendment we are informed by the Clerks that we cannot move amendments to these sessional or standing orders or any other standing orders from the 385 we already have.

Mr Michael Daley: That is a cowardly attack.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: It is not a cowardly attack. I will say it outside this place. The cowardice in this place is the Government's.

The SPEAKER: Order! I will ask the member not to reflect on the Clerk.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: The cowardice in this place is that of the Government that has devised these changes.

Mr Tony Stewart: Point of order. I ask that the member for Coffs Harbour withdraw his comments that the Clerk is working for the Government because they are derogatory and unparliamentary. I ask that he withdraw his remarks.

The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Bankstown has asked that those comments be withdrawn.

Mr ANDREW FRASER: I withdraw them. I have had 17 years of good relationship with the Clerk. I am dismayed that these changes have come before the House on the advice of the Clerks without reference to the Coalition or the crossbench. In the past we always have had the opportunity as part of the Standing Orders and Procedure Committee to discuss privately and separately with the Clerks and seek advice. I am disappointed today that this motion to change the sessional orders is before us and that when we tried to amend them Mr Speaker is advised by the Clerks that we cannot move such an amendment.

This is an important issue that we need to discuss. It is not fair to members that the Government is going to push these changes to the sessional orders through today, which will be adopted at the next sitting of this House—not today because the House will rise today. We should have the opportunity to discuss the changes in committee and individually with the Clerk and the Presiding Officer of this House prior to them being adopted. I suggest that debate on the motion be withdrawn until we can consider the changes fully.

[Business interrupted.][Business interrupted.]